Rome and Carthage - Relative power in the world.

[Timotheus]

When Carthage led by the forces of Hannibal went to war with the Romans it was the beginnning of the end for them as a society.

Sure they made a good run at it but in the end they were defeated by rome and eventually they city was razed in the farce that is called the 3rd Punic War.

So I am curious. If one was to rank power level where did Rome and Carthage at the time of the 2nd war when compared to other powers of the Med Sea area?

Would Carthage have been smarter and had a better chance if they had expanded a little in Spain then avoided annoying Rome by turning east and attempting to conquer Egypt? Would Carthage have had a chance or would she have been totally outclassed by Egypt?

[taira1180]

In the first place, Cartage never cared much about the war, they let it be almost a private war from Hannibal. They weren't interested in big conquests, so they would never try to conquer the Egypt, only get settlements to expand their commerce.

[Magnus]

Tough to say...war with Rome was unavoidable, since both Carthage and Rome were expanding their empires at this point. Egypt vs Carthage....depends if Egypt enlisted the aid of Rome or not...but if they didn't, I would think Egypt would have fallen to Carthage's superior Navy and Army, especially under Hannibal.

[Decimus Aurelius Varus]

Well from what I remember when I was talking to Hannibal, it seemed that his desire for revenge brought Carthage into the wars more than they wanted to. I think that if he pitted his might against Egypt instead of traversing through the Alps, Spain, and Gaul to get to Rome, he could have controlled a huge part of Egypt. Of course, I didnt ask him this when I interviewed him, I didnt want him to cut my tongue off... :wink:
So I guess I agree with you guys there.

[Timotheus]

Tough to say...war with Rome was unavoidable, since both Carthage and Rome were expanding their empires at this point. Egypt vs Carthage....depends if Egypt enlisted the aid of Rome or not...but if they didn't, I would think Egypt would have fallen to Carthage's superior Navy and Army, especially under Hannibal.

The question would be if Rome would decide to intervene in any way. Would Carthage have been volating any treaties if she moved east against Egypt at that time period?

Did Egypt and Rome have any formal alliances at this point? If they did then war could have happened but most if not all of it would have been fought in Africa though it would be likely that Rome would have still attacked whatever Hispania assets Carthage may have acquired.

[Sean Manning]

Could Carthage have invaded Egypt? You need a harbour every day or two to move an ancient fleet, since the rowers have nowhere to cook, sleep, or stretch their legs onboard, and the southern Mediterranean isn't well supplied with harbours and sheltered bays. Water could also have been a problem moving that way. Rome, Macedon, the Greek city states, and the Seleucids were in the way of a northern route by Sicily-Italy-Greece-Crete-Alexandria.

[john m roberts]

Rome would never have allowed a rival like Carthage to control Egypt. Egypt was unbelievably rich and Rome depended on the Egyptian wheat harvest almost as much as the Egyptians did. Rome itself avoided conquering Egypt as long as possible because no Roman political family could stand the idea of another family getting control of Egypt, so Rome's policy was to prop up one weak Ptolemy after another. This suited Rome very well, as the Senate dominated Egypt without any Roman owning the place. Caesar saw no reason why he shouldn't own the place so he took over, ruling through Cleopatra. Augustus considered Egypt so important that he made it his personal property and forbade any Roman of Senatorial rank to go there without his permission. No, Rome would definitely have gone to war to keep Carthage out of Egypt.

[Magnus]

Ditto to what John said.

Sean, I think Carthage could have...There's decent sized towns right on the coast of the Med stretching along the north african coast from Tripolitania, Syrtica, Cryrenaica, Libya up to Egypt.