Roman law in the Middle Ages

[Jona Lendering]

In western law, it is possible to create a legal entity that is called "foundation". Examples from the Middle Ages are the guilds and the universities.

As far as I know, this construction did not exist in ancient times, which recognized only natural persons. So where did the Europeans get it from? My first idea was that it is a new development, until I realized that an Islamic waqf is essentially a foundation, that the Arabian schools were organized like waqfs, and that the western university is derived from the Islamic madrasa's.

Am I ignoring evidence for the existence of foundations from Roman Law?

[Theodosius the Great]

western university is derived from the Islamic madrasa's.

I'm not so sure. Constantinople had its own university in the early 5th century instituted by Theodosius II. Wouldn't western universities derive from that model ?

~Theo

[Carlton Bach]

The Constanmtinopolitan school is not a Western universitas. For that matter, though, neither is a madrassa. I'll have to go back to my books to get the details, but in general terms there seems to be a degree of affinity and copying each other's practices between Byzantine, Islamic and Western schools (with madrassas deriving much of their organisation from Byzantine models and in turn influencing schools in the western Med)

What I wonder about more is the question of 'legal entity'. I don't know whether this was fully codified until well into the medieval period. Neither am I entirely convinced it's not an idea that Roman law did not at least partially develop. Keep in mind that even in classical law, the collegium could own property and receive inheritances. My guess is that this developed further in the context of the CHristian requirement of apostolic poverty - a collegium could legally remain the joint property of its members, but monks and ascetics could not own any property, jointly or singly. Therefore, the concept of a coenobium owning something that its members did not would appear a natural extension of this principle.

I'll see if I find the time to get back to my research. this is one of the questions I've had on and off my radar for a while, with no certain answer as yet.

[Jona Lendering]

Wow, the apostolic poverty: never thought of that, but of course that is the clue. Thanks Volker.

As to the Islamic roots of the university - there is a lot to be said about it, but more than I can decently summarize. The books to read are George Makdisi, The Institutions of Learning in Islam and the West (1981) and The Rise of Humanism in Classical Islam and the Medieval West (1990). Extremely important books, because they break the western paradigm that all civilization came from Greece.

[Carlton Bach]

Wow, the apostolic poverty: never thought of that, but of course that is the clue. Thanks Volker.

As to the Islamic roots of the university - there is a lot to be said about it, but more than I can decently summarize. The books to read are George Makdisi, The Institutions of Learning in Islam and the West (1981) and The Rise of Humanism in Classical Islam and the Medieval West (1990). Extremely important books, because they break the western paradigm that all civilization came from Greece.

Thanks for the book pointers - I'd completely missed these so far. As to the apolstolic poverty thing, please be aware it is entirely speculative. I have no sources to back it up, it just sounded like a reasonably viable assumption to me. For all I know, it could all be down to some 'household representation' tradition in Germanic law...

[Jona Lendering]

As to the apolstolic poverty thing, please be aware it is entirely speculative. I have no sources to back it up, it just sounded like a reasonably viable assumption to me.

I realize that, but it is more plausible than an islamic background.