Germanic names

[M. Demetrius]

<hijack>
Robert, do you have a source for Germanic names? Marcomanni, Suebi, Cimbri, or Teuton type preferred, though there must surely be some crossover, as their languages were somewhat similar, compared to Gaulic names and language.

Considering a slightly earlier period, more like 1st/2nd Cent AD.
<\\hijack>

[Robert Vermaat]

Hi David,

I split the post, thast seems easier to find the material later.

What names do you mean? Personal names, tribal names?

[M. Demetrius]

Robert,
Thanks for your help. I'm looking for personal names, male and female are what I'm having some trouble finding, more along the Rhine to Western Danube than further north, or south east toward the Dacians.

The tribes were many, and not much is written about many of them that I can find here in the US. I guess that's because the Romans had less interaction with them than with the Gauls, for example, and none of those people wrote much down. I'm assuming their histories were kept by bards, something like the Celts in Gaul and Britain.

Do you regard this article as reasonably accurate?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_peoples

[Tiberius Clodius Corvinus]

I would be interested in a list of Germanic names, also.

Does anyone happen to have a link or else?

[authun]

Best list for Anglo Saxon names is PASE. This is a scholarly database. It does contain non AS names but is strongly weighted to post christian names, because they were written down.

http://www.pase.ac.uk/pase/apps/persons/index.html

German sites tend to contain name elements, from which you can make up your own names.This is a good one to start with:

http://www.brian-zimmermann.de/germanen ... -namen.htm

eg.
Wigand (Der Kämpfende),
Wigbald (Der im Kampf Kühne),
Wigbert (Der prächtiger Kämpfer),
Wighard, Wighart, Wigmar (Der kühne Kämpfer),

doesn't include Wiglaf, Beowulf's sidekick

These two may have some different names included:

http://hometown.aol.de/blutsventebln/germVornamen.html
http://hometown.aol.de/blutsventebln/Germ.Vornamen.html

best

harry A

[Tiberius Clodius Corvinus]

thanks Harry,

i'll have a look

.... meanwhile found this link.
http://www.gaminggeeks.org/Resources/Ka ... ermany.htm
The strange thing is that no link so far contains all names we know from Tacitus et al. :?

[Decius]

my second name means "Der durch Verstand Glänzende" ( he, who has a brilliant mind)

8)

[garrelt]

Maybe the link below can also be of some help

http://www.keesn.nl/names/index.html

My first name is old frisian/groningen, and means (as i'm told) Spear Bearer.

Gar = Spear (geer geir ger)
relt = carrier bearer

[S SEVERUS]

Indeed.
My name is Geert what is translated to "Man with the spear"

[Urselius]

There is a clear break in Anglo-Saxon naming practices, at around 650AD.

The earlier type of name tended to be short and snappy, rather nickname-like: Horsa - horse, Hengest - stallion, Reada - the red, Illa - ?, Aesc - ash spearshaft, Penda - poss. Celtic - "the boss," Ida - ?, Pybba-? Oswy-? etc.

The later type becomes more sonorous and is usually bi-partite: aelfwine -elf-friend, Beorhthelm - bright-helmet, Aethelred - noble-council, Hereweard - defender of the army etc.

[authun]

thanks Harry,
The strange thing is that no link so far contains all names we know from Tacitus et al. :?

The longer names which comprise of two elements are called dithematic names, those with one element are termed monothematic. Monothematic names does persist but are not visible in most AS records. Consequently we get a false impression of their absence. A place to look for them however is in the late Anglo Saxon placenames. Many have a monothematic personal name element.

Hoops makes this assertion in the RGA:

"These records are an important source for the lower classes of late
Anglo Saxon rural society as well as for the names of the local elites
and one finds a more varied and conservative onomastic structure than
in the witness lists of late Anglo Saxon diplomas where monothematic
names are practically non existant ..."

Examples are: Eatta, Brynca, Dudda.

Some monothematic names are hypocoristic, that is, more familar or pet names. Sæberht, the King of Essex was, according to Bede, known as Saba by his sons. This monthematic hypocoristic name is therefore really a dithematic name. Dudda is also hypocoristic but in this case the more formal variety is Dud.

best
Harry Amphlett

[authun]

Sorry, I missed the main point about Tacitus. Romans wrote the names down differently so germanic 'Hadu' would usually be written down as 'Catu'.

As many names, germanic and celtic have PIE elements, this can be very confusing. For example, the welsh king of gwent Tewdrig can be interpreted as germanic Tudric, the same as Theoderic. How the Romans wrote these things down, for they are the main source, has probably sent many historians down the wrong path.

best

Harry A

[Urselius]

Ok, I should have said "There is a clear break in upper-class Anglo-Saxon naming practices, at around 650AD."

I thought Tewdrig was derived from Theoderic (Morris seemed to think so) - Rhodri is derived from Roderic so it wouldn't be the only Welsh princely name with a Germanic origin.

The element rix (Celtic) - ric (Germanic) for ruler are so close that it is impossible to separate their use in names.

[authun]

Ok, I should have said "There is a clear break in upper-class Anglo-Saxon naming practices, at around 650AD."

Maybe this has something to do with conversion to Christianity?

I thought Tewdrig was derived from Theoderic (Morris seemed to think so) - Rhodri is derived from Roderic so it wouldn't be the only Welsh princely name with a Germanic origin.

It was a commonly held view at one time and, in the 19th cent. possible explanations of Gothic or Jutish settlers were proposed. But both tud and rig are celtic elements too, cf. Welsh inscription Monedorigi, "mountain-king". As you say, impossible to separate without the benefit of some more contextual information.

best
Harry A

[Urselius]

The A-S did seem to demand double-barelled names by the late 7th century so that the man who took the Roman name Benedict is always referred to as "Benedict Biscop" his job became the second element in his name.

The similarity of some name elements gives rise to a number of alternative derivations: Cynric could mean "kin-ruler" in A-S or quite possibly "hound-king" in Old British.