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Rank of a Centurian in the Auxilla
#1
After much looking what is the title / rank of the head Centurian of a 1000 strong unit? I know the Legionary off by heart but the Auxilla hmm. The only title I have is centurio princeps which is either the grade of the second or third centurian in the Legion. Any help would greatly recieved  Wink
Regards Brennivs Big Grin
Woe Ye The Vanquished
                     Brennvs 390 BC
When you have all this why do you envy our mud huts
                     Caratacvs
Centvrio Princeps Brennivs COH I Dacorivm (Roma Antiqvia)
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#2
(06-15-2016, 09:05 PM)brennivs - tony drake Wrote: The only title I have is centurio princeps which is either the grade of the second or third centurian in the Legion. 

I've always thought it was centurio princeps, whether the cohort was quingenary or milliary. The difference with the legion ranks being, presumably, that the auxiliary centuries were not graded as hastati etc.

However, I've had a look through the epigraphy database and this exact rank doesn't seem to be listed anywhere! The closest matches I could find are these:


EDCS-31100168 (Eining): Felicis]sim[o princ(ipi)] / [co]h(ors) III [Brit(annorum)

AE 1968, 00436 (Zemun): Aur(elius) Pro/pincus pri(nceps) / co(ho)r(tis) pri(mae) Ca/mpanorum


So it looks like plain princeps or principes was an auxiliary rank, although there's no actual indication that these men were centurions, let alone leading ones...

It would be interesting to know if this is supported anywhere else.
Nathan Ross
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#3
(06-15-2016, 10:43 PM)Nathan Ross Wrote:
(06-15-2016, 09:05 PM)brennivs - tony drake Wrote: The only title I have is centurio princeps which is either the grade of the second or third centurian in the Legion. 

I've always thought it was centurio princeps, whether the cohort was quingenary or milliary. The difference with the legion ranks being, presumably, that the auxiliary centuries were not graded as hastati etc.

However, I've had a look through the epigraphy database and this exact rank doesn't seem to be listed anywhere! The closest matches I could find are these:


EDCS-31100168 (Eining): Felicis]sim[o princ(ipi)] / [co]h(ors) III [Brit(annorum)

AE 1968, 00436 (Zemun): Aur(elius) Pro/pincus pri(nceps) / co(ho)r(tis) pri(mae) Ca/mpanorum


So it looks like plain princeps or principes was an auxiliary rank, although there's no actual indication that these men were centurions, let alone leading ones...

It would be interesting to know if this is supported anywhere else.
I just started a thread on citizen cohorts.
James Ajiduah
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#4
(06-15-2016, 09:05 PM)brennivs - tony drake Wrote:  The only title I have is centurio princeps which is either the grade of the second or third centurian in the Legion. 

From my understanding, there are 2 different principes in the roman army.

1. The (Primus) Princeps (prior), who is the 2nd highest centurio of a legion:
A centurio primi ordines and a kind of administrative head of the legion. Here the word princeps means that he belongs to the 2nd group (Principes) of the old manipular organisation

2. The centurio princeps of an auxilia cohort:
He is the highest centurio of the cohort (6 or 10 centuries does not matter). All other centurions (5 or 9) are from the same lower rank. The centurio princeps was most probably the deputy of the prefect or tribune and had similar administrative duties like the princeps of a legion.
Here princeps just means "The First". Like the emperor was princeps (primus inter pares) or like in princeps officii.

That is at least what I have read in Cheesman, The roman Auxilia, and Domaszewski, Die Rangordnung des römischen Heeres. I can't rememeber that any historian of the last 100 years disagreed with these guys about the centurio princeps.
Ut desint vires, tamen est laudanda voluntas
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#5
Yes this seems to be a grey area, I know that Legion Centurians were some times posted to the Auxilla as Centurians or as Prefects but on there pay scale.  But what pay scale were Auxilla Centurians,  I presume they must have been in line with the Legionary Centurian even if the title was not the same?  I know the head Centurian  of a Auxilla is not a Primvs Pilvs  but to me he has a responsibility for the whole unit and to the Prefect? Or am I just looking at it too deep Huh Big Grin
Thanks for the imput Nathan and Longinvs.
regards Brennivs Big Grin
Woe Ye The Vanquished
                     Brennvs 390 BC
When you have all this why do you envy our mud huts
                     Caratacvs
Centvrio Princeps Brennivs COH I Dacorivm (Roma Antiqvia)
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#6
(06-16-2016, 09:49 AM)brennivs - tony drake Wrote: But what pay scale were Auxilla Centurians,  I presume they must have been in line with the Legionary Centurian even if the title was not the same?  


Actually we have no clue about the pay of an centurio of an auxiliary cohort. There is no clear evidence, but there are some reasonable estimations. Like Speidel did in "Roman army pay scales". Looking to the promotions, he believes that the ordinary cohort centurio got about 5 times standard pay. While the legionary centurio got about 15 times standard pay.

Probably the centurio princeps was paid better, like the centurio primi ordinis was paid better in the legion. But again: we have no clue.
Ut desint vires, tamen est laudanda voluntas
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#7
Thank you very much Frank Big Grin that was very well explained , to me after posting I thought maybe they is not much written about subject that the public then knew if you said you were a Auxilla Centurian of a Cohort you were this equvillant to a Legio Centurian of X rank. It would need to be inline with the Legions for promotion if you were to gain a commission to the Legions. The reason I am asking I was promoted in the group after 29 years of servive Blush so I decided to stay in my Auxilla regiment as Centurian this information fills in a gap to the overall understanding of the life of a Centurian. Also I can make new kit for myself for once Big Grin
Thanks once again to all Smile
Regards Brennivs Big Grin
Woe Ye The Vanquished
                     Brennvs 390 BC
When you have all this why do you envy our mud huts
                     Caratacvs
Centvrio Princeps Brennivs COH I Dacorivm (Roma Antiqvia)
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#8
(06-16-2016, 10:05 AM)Frank Wrote: Actually we have no clue about the pay of an centurio of an auxiliary cohort. There is no clear evidence, but there are some reasonable estimations. Like Speidel did in "Roman army pay scales". Looking to the promotions, he believes that the ordinary cohort centurio got about 5 times standard pay. While the legionary centurio got about 15 times standard pay.

Probably the centurio princeps was paid better, like the centurio primi ordinis was paid better in the legion. But again: we have no clue.

By the 5th and 6th c, the tribunus (commanding a new-style legion of c. 1000 men) received probably 7.5 times as much as the ordinary miles.
Robert Vermaat
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FECTIO Late Romans
THE CAUSE OF WAR MUST BE JUST
(Maurikios-Strategikon, book VIII.2: Maxim 12)
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