Done Titus. I'll email you.<br>
I've been flying a lot lately..<br>
..And Adam, I bought the book too and I don't feel like an idiot. This great piece of work is a wealth of information.<br>
I had never heard of the arming cap, for instance. Neither of the fastening loops attached to the horse armour to tie it to the saddle, not to mention the very mysterious piece of wood affixed to the said horse armour, right in the middle just behind the saddle.. The list goes on and on. This book is a reference and an important one, I think. <p></p><i></i>
Looking up the published Vindolanda letters from c. 100 AD, one list contains cloaks x 6(infibulatoria) 11.5 denarii each , head-bands x 5 0.75 denarii each, hair (for plumes??) 9 pounds, 5.75 denarii per pound, saddle. 12 denarii, cloaks (saga) x 15 , more cloaks x 15 bags x 10 0.6 denarii each etc. The list looks like a shopping list of clothing, equestrian equipmen, utensils , and textiles.<br>
The word for translated as headbands is capitularia - my Latin is not good enough to say whether that could also be a cap or hat. The price is similar to that of a bag, so we are not talking about an elaborate item.<br>
(page 141, letter 35, Life & Letters on the Roman Frontier, Alan Bowman, 1998 edition).<br>
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PS Another item mentioned elsewhere is a sub paenula- I assume this was a extra detached lining to the paenula to keep warm in the Northern winters!<br>
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wow- antoninus you don't fancy being my bank manager do you? seriously though, I totally agree, it is worth the money several times over. <p></p><i></i>
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Adam-<br>
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I haven’t seen the book so I’m at an obvious disadvantage here, but your description makes it sound like the notorious Phrygian cap. But the earflaps, back flap, and the fact that it’s made of wool (in the desert?) also makes me think of the ubiquitous steppe cap, which has maintained remarkably consistent attributes from the version worn by the ancient Scythians through to the modern-day version worn in Mongolia. Is there any chance it might actually be Parthian and not Roman?<br>
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Well, that’s just wild speculation. As you say, it could well be an arming cap. Does the book offer enough detail for a possible reconstruction?<br>
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Gregg<br>
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Since it was found at Dura it could indeed be a piece of persian equipment. The felt extension at the back could also be helpful to absorb the constant beating of a mail neck guard against the back of the neck while riding a horse, for instance. As for wool in the desert, yes indeed. The desert is a very cold place at night and this particular area is know for its harsh climate, with extremes of cold and heat.<br>
As for heat, when the temperature outside is something like 70 degrees centigrades under the sun, you're pretty glad to have wool clothing to keep your body temperature at a cool 37 degrees.. Ask a Targui, for example<br>
Simon James writes that the flattened top is a sure sign that this cap was worn under a helmet. However, in Persia, wearing a "phrygian" cap with the point upright was the privilege of the King of Kings. The commoners had to wear it with the top flattened, like the Dura example.<br>
The striking feature actually is the felt extension at the back of the neck.<br>
To describe it better: the skull is made of four triangular segments, with the felt lined ear flaps attached to it and the felt backflap extending quite low on the neck. The flattened top is not as big as a prygian cap. There are two detailed photographs on the book including one of the cap worn by a local kid, just after discovery. It is I think definitely reconstructable. <p></p><i></i>
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Antoninus –<br>
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You’re right about the desert at night, of course, but I wasn’t aware of the cooling effects of wool. That’s very interesting. And by your description it doesn’t sound like a Phrygian cap either. I wonder if it really could be an arming cap of some kind. Is there any mention of the thickness of the fabric? Does it have a chinstrap? Though I suppose a chinstrap wouldn’t be necessary if the helmet itself had a strap of some kind. Would this cap have offered any particular benefit with any known Roman helmets from the era of Roman control of Dura? I note the inclusion of felt. I suppose that was done for the comfort of the ears and back of the neck, though I might note that felt was supposedly one of the better materials to use as padding against piercing weapons.<br>
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For fairness sake I’ve been planning on writing another post with all the evidence I can find on the other possibility, that Roman helmets did indeed have some kind of padding glued inside. But I’m starting to wonder if it isn’t possible that the Romans may have used both, depending on the type of helmet being utilized. Maybe big domed helmets really did need an arming cap of some kind, and maybe helmets lower to the skull had an integral lining. I know some medieval helmets used both.<br>
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Well, I’ll try to post the other evidence later…<br>
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Gregg<br>
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In the book it actually says that it is woven in one piece, not four triangular bits. I originally had mistaken the apparent thread/stitch line up the front quarter for a seam, but the text says not, and you can see not join when you look close and it could be this was for tacking the lining of felt. It got the impression that the whole thing was lined with felt, but that there was only felt on the neck and no "outer" layer/covering of wool there, but that could be the way I first read it, it is after all an ambiguous description.<br>
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it also says flaps between the ear tabs folded inward and sewed? I think this means it was woven in a cone shape, a piece was then cut out for the face, and the back piece was slit up either side, folded under and inside and tacked down. The second photo certainly seems to have a folded hem at the back.<br>
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there is also a hole about 6cm above the ear flap which appears to have felt poking through which could also support this?<br>
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"As for wool in the desert, yes indeed. The desert is a very cold place at night and this particular area is know for its harsh climate, with extremes of cold and heat." Having lived in the Middle East, especially at night where temperatures drop dramatically! And on a practical note, He-whose-name-cannot-be-mentioned-on-RAT says that an internal removable cap works well as an overnight cap on campaign- almost like a pillow.<br>
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The Dura description sounds fascinating- any chance of a scanned picture?<br>
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I am looking forward to the evidence for the internal attached padding as well- and agree that we should not expect uniformity here. This would be very much a personal decision, I suspect. If you had just had a paddingless helmet issued, you might just use some old cloth, or a Greek-style headband. Some might use an "arming cap", some a Phrygian, some a "Dura Europas". And I suspect that these could be used with or without attached internal padding. And some would just use the internal padding. Gives us lots of choice! <p></p><i></i>
Can anyone post a picture of the felt arming cap? Perhaps it was used by someone with a small head and a large helmet to take up the slack. It could very well be that a liner was glued into the helmet and a cap also worn. <p></p><i></i>
I have a scan of this having finally given in and bought the book. Over-priced, but very wonderful.<br>
I have difficulty posting pictures (I can link to a web picture, but can I post something that I have a scan of? Nope....), but if you send me your email address I can email it to you for posting here.<br>
Yours , technologically challenged<br>
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Paulus <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p200.ezboard.com/bromanarmytalk.showUserPublicProfile?gid=paulusbrittanicus>Paulus Brittanicus</A> at: 11/12/04 7:59 pm<br></i>
Thank you , my email address is [email protected] <p></p><i></i>
Here's a scan of the Dura cap.<br>
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home.armourarchive.org/me...l/Dura.jpg <p></p><i></i>
Thanks! I also think that the Dura cap can allow re-interpretation of other scultures- for example one sculpture in the Ashmolean, Oxford shows Roman soldiers with captives wearing hats that (IIRC) look remarkably similar.<br>
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Regards<br>
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Paulus <p></p><i></i>
Hi, New to the forum, but just thought i might add a little to it,<br>
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Soldiers, from any period, from those thousands of years ago to the present day have constantly adapted their equipment to suit the conditions, for example compare the photo's/ Illustrations of the Napoleons army retreating from Moscow to that of the Germans in World War 2, using what ever they could to keep them warm, wrapping cloth around their feet appears in film footage and in illustrations from a century before.<br>
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Why? Because they adapted what they had at hand, it wasn't uniform, but they used it.<br>
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Also all the illustrations, drawings/fresco's of Roman Soldiers will always be showing them in their best light, as they would have been as they marched out the gates of Rome for the very first time, rather than what a legionary may have looked like after years on campaign.<br>
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Look what Wellington said in Spain and Portugal, his troops were so raggedy that the only way he could tell what regiment they were in was by the color of their collars, for all the rest of their uniforms were patched with local cloth.<br>
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I think that if a Roman soldier was on campaign and found something that made his helmet more wearable he would simply have utilized it, come the summer he may have dumped it for something else, whatever he used, it would have to keep his helmet secure, be easily changeable and available, from materials used within the camp or fort? We've all seen what the inside of a helmet what ever the period looks like after a few hours in the sun, imagine what it would have looked like after a year or so.<br>
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I think until someone finds one intact we will never know, but even if we did that may only ever be right for one soldier, for one day of one month of one year.<br>
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After all, why couldn't he had made it out of leather, similar to what a us soldiers helmet looked like in world war two, not a hard design and seeing these guys managed to build aqueducts over 1500 years ago, I think they may have come up with something like that?<br>
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Just thoughts.... adapt and overcome!!!<br>
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Kormanus <p></p><i></i>
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I've tested the Dura cap last weekend (three hours in snowy forest) under a Niedermoermter steel. It was quite comfortable and kept my ears warm very well.<br>
It's hard to see in the image because of the helmet<br>
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<img src="http://www.populares-vindelicenses.de/bilder/marcvs1-2.jpg" style="border:0;"/> <p></p><i></i>
Florian Himmler (not related!)
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