Modifying Deepeeka Italic D AH6054

[PhilusEstilius]

Jay.
I do think that your N model is by far a better helmet than the first shown by Matt, looks a bit like Deepeeka are getting their act together somewhat.

[Gaius Colletti]

Thank you Jay & Brian.

Brian, since you have experience in making these helmets, do you know how I might engrave the temples in the rear? I thought about taking a flathead screwdriver to it, and lighting tapping it into the brass with a hammer to get the desired affect. But as I do not have the helmet yet, I don't know how soft or thick the brass is to do this.

[PhilusEstilius]

Matt.
Where we are modern copyists I think that we may be allowed to cheat a little and get out our Dremel for that sort of thing, then if it looks to good a very small neddle file in one or two grooves can help to get the desired effect.

[PhilusEstilius]

Matt.
Where I have even mentioned the idea of countersinking with flat head rivets put in from the inside of the bowl to hold things is also cheating.
As indeed Jay has mentioned his decor' figures are soldered onto his so I do think this is in the correct direction for I think it could all have been braised together as a basket, then when that had been applied to the bowl soldering the eagles and shrines would not have affected any of the braising.
All of this makes you wonder are we getting near to understanding just how this kind of thing was done and it may be of some help to others to be able do it all in the future correctly.

[DECIMvS MERCATIvS VARIANvS]

Some good ideas. But again, i think sometimes we hobbyists take things too far. Were I to get motivated and work on my original deepeeka "D" I would take the eagles I cut out and never got put on, engrave them in a pattern that I found pleasing and do some engraving on the temples, etc. I'd make the "milk can" hoojies that hold on the brow reinforce smaller and work on the read "handle and surrounds.

The "N" would need less work to make me happier, except that they made the bowl really small... my head is not round.

Guys, make it something you'll enjoy, not some copy to the nth degree of an ancient artifact. Think living, breathing people. Our forebears were not staid, black and white statues. And really, until the 19th century, truly interchangeable parts did not exist, so nothing was really identical.
My opinions and not an opening shot. Just an opinion.
~Marsh
P.S. Brian, that helmet is great. I talked to the guy who owned it a few years ago... when I was really into the "D"/ Nice work. Do you still think it should be black?? I always wondered about that.

[markusaurelius]

Do you still think it should be black?? I always wondered about that

Not if its made out of iron. I'm pretty sure it looks black NOW because a chemical has been used to preserve the iron core. Something that is commonly done to help preserve it. The original would likely have been a polished iron.

If anyone has done any body work to a rusty car and used the rust inhibitor chemicals they'll know what I'm talking about. It converts the iron to a black color which is hard, before you would then go on to fill the hole with bondo etc.

[PhilusEstilius]

Marsh.

I have had mixed thoughts about this black idea however in the H.R.Robinson book we find it does look black, but then it may well be as Markus has pointed out about how the preservation was carried out.
In another copy of it that I did I used a gas torch to do a blueing job of it, and I was happy with that so I suppose it will keep the rust at bay for some time to come.

[Gaius Colletti]

Hey everybody, sorry for the delay, I have been on vacation. The helmet, despite it's numerous flaws is still a rather attractive piece, albeit much heavier than my Gallic A & H helms.

In case anybody was wondering, the size is 8.5"x7.5" (21.6cm x 19.1) so slightly more oval than some of Deepeeka's other helms, I understand sometime ago Deepeeka started getting helm caps from a company that makes cooking pans, hence their more round dimensions.

Another issue that I was hoping not to have to deal with is the neckguard, it is 4.5" (11.4cm) long compared to my Gallic H's 3.75" (9.5cm), which is large enough to seemingly get in the way while wearing segmentata, the slope of the sngle is not that bad though, it seems to be less than my Gallic H's. On a side note, compared to my Gallic H, it is nice to have a helmet with cheekguards that actually cover my whole chin lol

For comparison:
[attachment=4582]0708021734.jpg[/attachment]


I suppose I could trim down the neckguard with a dremel (does anyone else have any other suggestions), how what gauge brass should I use to put at the "new" end of the neckguard, and what method should be used to apply it (keep in mind I don't really have a way to solder it on), metal glue maybe?

On my to do list:
1. Make new eagles, I may know a local company who could cut out the eagles, 22 gauge?
2. Engrave rear temples
3. Filing notches on the browguard, though I'm not completely sold on this
4. Trim neckguard
5. File down earguards to correct shape, which even the N-series falls short on


Things not on my immediate list:
1. Replacing the crossbars with thinner brass. This would involve reworking nearly all the brass decorations on the helmet
2. Replacing "Milk jug" browguard knobs, they aren't all that different from the originals, plus how the hell would I even go about making new ones?
3. Carrying handle on the neckguard, this one sort of pains me, I could easily enough bend brass wire, but what about the decorative ends? Mind you, I don't have access to smelt my own version.

Again this is not meant to be an exact replica of the Mainz helmet, but a model based closely on the Italic D design, or a generic Mainz helmet. Stitch-counters I understand your frustrations, but unless you are willing to provide me with an accurate version, either don't invite me to your events or just ask my to bring my Gallic A or H

A look at the rear temple, overall good shape:

[attachment=4583]0708021757.jpg[/attachment]

[Manius Acilius Italicus]

Matt, I bought a 3" cutoff from Harbor Freight and found it to be much much faster than my dremel and the wheels are inexpensive. Looks as if you are taking on a lot of work to rework those helms.
If you haven't done so yet, take a look at the one I am working on under reconstruction in the beginner's section. I used the cutoff to do the ouside shape of it.
Anything I can do to help, just ask.

Manius Acilius Italicus
aka Bob Cherry

[richsc]

As an aside, what is a 3" cutoff?

[Gaius Colletti]

Rich: http://www.harborfreight.com/120-volt-3-...68523.html

Thanks for the suggestion Robert, it is most appreciated

[Primvs Pavlvs]

A simple pair of heavy duty tin snips will give you better control at trimming the tail.

[Gaius Colletti]

Thanks Paul, tin snips is a great suggestion. How about trimming the earguards to an end at each point? Would that be something easily filed down? Anybody?

[Manius Acilius Italicus]

Sorry I took so long to get back to you Richard. Harbor Freight item #68523. They call it a "high speed cut-off tool. I tried my aviation shears and tin snips on the sheet metal to no avail. This little tool zipped through it easily. I just bought some new cutting discs, $5.99 for ten...much cheaper than Dremmel.

[Rado]

I found this today as information on Italic D model.

As I understand it is produced by German master blacksmith Die römische Antike Ole-Hendrik Albers .

I'm not into the details of this Imperial Italic D model ,but it is seems to me that it is a work of a high master level.