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linothorax and other white cuirases
#36
Quote:My point? You seem to want us to take artistic representations at face value, but they are much more inconsistent than you seem to realize. And you can't just pick and choose which details you like and which you don't if your position is that that we trust every artistic representation as accurate.
Of course we don't need to throw the baby out with the bath water. Roman art is generally quite realistic, and the artists had a better chance to see the armor as it really was than we do. But Roman artists did take license with their work, and excessive trust in their representations leads only to strained rationalizations.

Agreed. You see, Xavi, in all honesty, all I see with your argument is bias. You clearly believe, or want to believe, in the existence and use of leather/textile muscled cuirass by Roman officers. What we're saying is that there is absolutely no evidence, or really any reason to believe (beyond what Hollywood has conjured that is) in the existence of such armor. If it did exist, and remnants are found in some archaeological context, I'd be happy to admit them to the realm of all that we know. However, as it is, you're arguing for the existence of something that isn't even likely to have existed, given what we do know about the Greco-Roman world. To reiterate the broad points of my argument against is quite simple:

1) Roman art is completely subjective and almost totally unreliable when it comes to discerning reality. You can argue this point to death, but I think my point is obvious. Go take another look at all the obvious blunders on Trajan's column for case in point.

2) Leather/linen would not have either the functionality you describe, nor the necessary functionality to be worn/protective in a military setting. BTW, have you even ever seen any reproduction, of the multitudes in leather I've seen in Hollywood and costume/reenactment setting, that even remotely look like what is depicted in Roman art? No, because a leather cuirass doesn't look like what's depicted either.

3) We already know that both the Greeks and Italians had muscled cuirasses made from metal, and that despite the stereotypes (too heavy, cumbersome, etc.), a proper fitting cuirass made from metal would have been both protective and suitably maneuverable for the wearer.
Alexander


Messages In This Thread
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-03-2014, 07:07 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-03-2014, 11:48 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-04-2014, 04:19 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-04-2014, 04:35 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-04-2014, 05:03 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-04-2014, 06:28 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-05-2014, 05:03 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-05-2014, 05:06 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-05-2014, 10:28 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 04:59 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 05:10 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 05:12 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 05:24 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 06:01 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 12:15 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Alexand96 - 10-06-2014, 02:08 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 04:31 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 07:03 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 09:16 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 09:24 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 09:38 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Urselius - 10-07-2014, 11:04 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 11:35 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 11:37 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 02:30 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 06:36 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 07:27 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 08:31 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 08:40 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 08:47 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-07-2014, 09:09 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-08-2014, 08:56 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-08-2014, 09:21 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-08-2014, 11:47 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-09-2014, 09:29 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-09-2014, 10:15 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-09-2014, 10:45 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-09-2014, 11:17 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-09-2014, 11:23 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-09-2014, 02:46 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 08:34 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Alanus - 10-10-2014, 09:54 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 01:13 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 02:55 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 04:57 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 05:05 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 06:47 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 09:09 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 09:09 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-10-2014, 09:09 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 09:26 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 02:08 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 04:13 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 05:19 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 05:56 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 06:08 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-11-2014, 08:15 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-12-2014, 09:38 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-12-2014, 03:16 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-12-2014, 05:12 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-12-2014, 09:48 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-19-2014, 04:41 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-20-2014, 09:25 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-20-2014, 07:17 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Renatus - 10-22-2014, 02:05 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-22-2014, 08:19 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Bryan - 10-23-2014, 04:24 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-23-2014, 07:35 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Bryan - 10-23-2014, 05:07 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-24-2014, 09:29 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-24-2014, 02:18 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Bryan - 10-24-2014, 03:49 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-24-2014, 03:59 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-24-2014, 06:02 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-25-2014, 09:33 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-25-2014, 01:56 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-25-2014, 02:54 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-25-2014, 04:57 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-25-2014, 11:24 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 12:27 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 12:34 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 12:51 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 09:21 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 09:26 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 09:37 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-27-2014, 09:43 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Renatus - 10-28-2014, 04:57 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-28-2014, 09:12 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Renatus - 10-28-2014, 09:34 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Renatus - 10-28-2014, 10:18 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Renatus - 10-28-2014, 11:07 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Bryan - 10-29-2014, 01:21 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-29-2014, 03:56 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Bryan - 10-29-2014, 05:54 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-29-2014, 06:55 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Vindex - 10-30-2014, 07:50 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-30-2014, 09:16 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-31-2014, 09:48 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-31-2014, 11:56 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-31-2014, 02:51 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Vindex - 10-31-2014, 06:11 PM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 09:39 AM
linothorax and other white cuirases - by Xavi B - 10-06-2014, 10:31 AM

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