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Post Diocletian Legion
#24
Hi again

Back in Brissie for a while.

I really did try to locate my original readings about the impact of the plague on the size of the later Roman Army, but to no avail. I mignt not be able to recall the sources but I was confident it'd be easy to recognize them. Hah!

Robert, I can't (sorry) sustain my comment about the attrition (to the existing establishment) due to "plague" being as much as a third. I just can't locate that source. The best I was able to do was this Wikipedia entry:

"The Plague of Cyprian is the name given to a pandemic, probably of smallpox, that afflicted the Roman Empire from 251 AD onwards. It was still raging in 270, when it claimed the life of emperor Claudius II Gothicus (ruled 268-70). The plague caused widespread manpower shortages in agriculture and the Roman army.[1]"*

(*"Plague of Cyprian." Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia. 24 May 2008. 7 Jan 2009 <[url:3hivwd0v]http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Plague_of_Cyprian&oldid=214605681[/url]>. )

Now, the citation (Note [1]) is "Zosimus New History 26, 37, 46". The only copy of Zosimus I was able to locate was online, and the "26, 37, 46" didn't help me. The only references in Book I that seemed relevant were:

(a) (ca 259-260 AD.) "Valerianus had by this time heard of the disturbances in Bithynia, ... and went in person from Antioch into Cappadocia, and after he had done some injury to every city by which he passed, he returned homeward. But the plague then attacked his troops, and destroyed most of them, at the time when Sapor made an attempt upon the east, and reduced most of it into subjection."

(b) (270 AD.) "Nor was the plague confined to the Barbarians alone, but began to infest the Romans, many of whom died, and amongst the rest Claudius, a person adorned with every virtue. His death was a severe loss to his subjects, and was consequently much regretted by them. "

((a) and (b) Zosimus, New History. London: Green and Chaplin (1814). Book 1., http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/zosimus01_book1.htm )

Was the "CyprianPlague" still raging in 270 AD? I gather this "Plague" only lasted for about 15 years so whatever killed Claudius II may have been another outbreak of maybe even a different disease. There do seem to have been a number of pandemics in the Third Century - not really surprising considering the frantic movement of armies around Europe and the Mediterranean during this century.

Zosimus himself (from what I read) seems to say only that the "plague" destroyed most of Valerianus' troops in the East. Maybe someone can interpret the "Zosimus New History 26, 37, 46" and show what supports the Wikipedia assertion that the "plague" caused "widespread manpower shortages in ... the Roman army."

However, what I had been trying to assert myself was that one or more pandemics during the Third Century could have whittled the army (empire-wide) to about two-thirds of its strength. To prove that, there were two facts to be sought:

(i) That pandemics had depleted the army significantly across the empire;
(ii) That the amount of depletion could have been as much as one-third.

Certainly, I won't stop looking for that elusive (? imagined??) source. But, for the present, neither point is supported. :oops:

Cheers for now

Howard / SPC
Spurius Papirius Cursor (Howard Russell)
"Life is still worthwhile if you just smile."
(Turner, Parsons, Chaplin)
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Messages In This Thread
Post Diocletian Legion - by Lothia - 12-14-2008, 02:13 AM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by D B Campbell - 12-14-2008, 09:38 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Lothia - 12-15-2008, 03:37 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by D B Campbell - 12-15-2008, 05:53 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 12-15-2008, 07:00 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 12-15-2008, 07:10 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by D B Campbell - 12-15-2008, 10:21 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Lothia - 12-16-2008, 03:49 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Urselius - 12-16-2008, 03:52 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 12-16-2008, 08:37 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Lothia - 12-17-2008, 02:28 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Urselius - 12-19-2008, 11:29 AM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 12-19-2008, 08:12 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Lothia - 12-20-2008, 12:27 AM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 12-20-2008, 04:44 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 12-24-2008, 12:12 PM
Post Diocletian Legion - by Spurius Papirius Cursor - 01-07-2009, 12:19 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by sonic - 01-07-2009, 04:20 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by Robert Vermaat - 01-08-2009, 07:54 PM
Re: Post Diocletian Legion - by fasta - 01-08-2009, 08:14 PM

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