Olympic Games (interesting, actually)

[Jona Lendering]

I would be the first to say that if the Greeks hadn't won the Persian Wars, we would have no democracy, philosophy, or science. What's wrong with saying that?

That it's a counterfactual argument, which is the historical equivalent of an illicit appeal. Holland suspends the rules of logic for the benefit of classicism. And he knows, or his advisers ought to know: the debate between Weber and Meyer is a classic.

Jona, could you summarize that French article on a 'scientific academy' in Babylon? I'm skeptical, but I don't yet read French.

You have every right, yes even a duty, to be skeptical. However, summarizing it right now is a bit more than I can do at the moment.

One of the strongest arguments for a connection between Babylonian and Alexandrine science is that the Babylonians tried to describe the celestial motions in algebraical terms. This is something we see again in Alexandria. There is little in Greece to prepare for that. We know that Pythagoras had an interest in mathematics, but the sources do not mention mathematical astronomy - and besides, they are too young to be helpful; the Pythagorean Theorem is never connected to the Samian Sage until the fourth century AD. Plato was interested in mathematics too, but never realized that you could use it to describe the planetary motions. That really is a Babylonian invention, which was picked up in Alexandria.

In the second place, please note that Alexander, after conquering Babylon, ordered the scientific literature to be translated into Greek; this is known from a very late Greek source, Simplicius; but the truth of his words is established because Simplicius correctly translates the Babylonian title of the Astronomical Diaries, massartu, as têrêseis, which is illogical in Greek but keeps the double meaning of 'guarding' and 'observing'. (The Arabian scientist Ibn Khaldun, who used other sources, tells the same.) The Callipean Calendar Reform took place ten months after the conquest of Babylon.

Finally, it is easy to overlook what is most obvious: nowhere in the Greek world was a state-sponsored scientific institution. Ptolemy knew Babylonia's Esagila, which had no less than fourteen sponsored astronomers, and must have decided to create something like that in his capital.

I think the first and second point are really proved, the third one is a plausible hypothesis. I hope this helps.