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Hoplite spacing and formation
#33
Quote:Giannis said:-
Quote:First they formed a 16 deep phalanx in loose order and then the 8 rear came to the front.
Sorry, Giannis, but this is simply incorrect. We are told in the sources that Hoplites generally stood 8 or 12 deep ( less on occasion, more for e.g. Thebans). We are also told in the few surviving manuals that 'open' order is the 'natural' order and has no special name, that the phalanx normally 'closed up' to close order, shields touching/overlapping to fight, and that when a desperate defence demanded it, an even closer formation with only 18" front per man could be utilised ( overlapped shields). There are two ways to interpret '8deep' - either it means open or closed formation. The moment you put this onto physical battlefields it becomes apparent that formations '8 deep' or '12 deep' must mean in open order, which then closed up, halving its depth, just before action.This also makes much more sense from an efficiency point of view as well. Only a Macedonian phalanx generally formed up 16 deep, in open order, and then closed up to '8 deep', close order to fight.

I agree with Paul here, from the viewpoint of Late Roman formations. A depth of 16 is a depth of 16. You could halve that to 8 if needed (for example to extend the front), or turn 8 ranks around to face an attack from the rear. There were commands for all those formations.

But there was no 'normal' procedure where 16 ranks deployed in open order and then had 8 ranks come up to the front simply to get to a close order. When synaspismos was needed, e.g. in a fulcum formation, the ranks pulled together, no doubt also shorthening the front in such a manouvre.
Robert Vermaat
MODERATOR
FECTIO Late Romans
THE CAUSE OF WAR MUST BE JUST
(Maurikios-Strategikon, book VIII.2: Maxim 12)
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Messages In This Thread
Hoplite spacing and formation - by PMBardunias - 11-03-2007, 01:49 AM
Hoplite formation - by Paullus Scipio - 11-03-2007, 07:50 AM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-03-2007, 09:18 AM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-03-2007, 11:29 AM
Re: Hoplite formations - by Robert Vermaat - 11-03-2007, 11:50 AM
Re: Hoplite formation - by Gaius Julius Caesar - 11-03-2007, 02:19 PM
Hoplite Formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-03-2007, 10:58 PM
Hoplite Formation - by Paullus Scipio - 11-03-2007, 11:55 PM
Re: Hoplite Formations - by Giannis K. Hoplite - 11-04-2007, 02:31 AM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-04-2007, 04:01 AM
Re: Hoplite Formations - by Robert Vermaat - 11-04-2007, 01:28 PM
Re: Hoplite spacing and formation - by Paralus - 11-05-2007, 01:09 AM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-05-2007, 01:47 AM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-05-2007, 04:52 AM
Re: Hoplite formations - by Sean Manning - 11-05-2007, 05:42 PM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-05-2007, 10:14 PM
Hoplite Formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-06-2007, 11:52 PM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-11-2007, 12:18 AM
Re: Hoplite formations - by PMBardunias - 11-12-2007, 04:50 PM
Hoplite Formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-13-2007, 12:48 AM
Hoplite formations - by Paullus Scipio - 11-13-2007, 03:08 AM

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