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+--- Thread: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm (/showthread.php?tid=9142)
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - garrelt - 05-20-2007
details
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - egfroth - 05-20-2007
Quote:Don't know if it fits in with the type but, anyone have information on the horn spangenhelm from Cologne? I believe it was found in a childs grave.
Yes. One of two "royal" graves "beneath" (whatever that means) Cologne Cathedral. Described in the book The Northern World as for a "six-year-old". I took a photocopy from the book years ago. See below.
No mention in the caption of the material it's made of - but somehow I seem to remember already knowing the plates were made of horn, so maybe it was mentioned in the text.
But the construction method is very unusual. Look at the intermediate frame pieces - they're too narrow for two rows of rivets- so how are the plates attached to the frame?
The only thing I can come up with is that they must be made the same way as the Benty Grange (7th century English) and Gjermundbu (Viking) helmets - with two frames - one beneath and one above the plates, with a single row of rivets passing between the two frames, "sandwiching" the plates in place.
You can't see the rivets on the photo, though that may just be because it's such a bad picture.
The fact that the plates are so narrow supports the idea that they are made of horn. The Benty Grange helmet is similar.
The aventail is quite obviously a modern addition - and again, I seem to remember that being mentioned in the text.
Theo - I've worn helmets with mail aventails for years. Never had a problem with my hair getting caught, though admittedly it's not all that long. I really can't see it being a hassle. Plenty of mediaeval re-enactors do the same, and many have really long hair. The leather is in far too good a condition to be anything but a modern addition, and I can see no reason to believe it's correct.
Mail would be a far superior protection against cutting than padding, though it doesn't protect against crushing injuries. But the leather under the mail (assuming it existed) would have basically no protective capability at all.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - egfroth - 05-20-2007
Quote:Frankly, I prefer not to have a nose guard on my helmet anyway since it's more common in later types as you say.
~Theo
Just because, here's the decorative gilt-bronze plate from the brow of the Lombard king Agilulf's helmet, from about the same time as the others. No sign of any provision for a nasal.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Franklin - 05-21-2007
Quote:details
Beautiful leather work Garrelt.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - garrelt - 05-21-2007
the cologne childerens grave helmet is made of horn spangen with copper alloy strips to hold it together.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - garrelt - 05-21-2007
the cheekpieces of th cologne helmet are of the same constrution as the spangen.
Horn width a copper alloy rim.
I use the term copper alloy because this term is used in archeology for a alloy with copper as its base and tin or zink as the alloy.
Not to forget the other materials like lead and sulpher (burning charcoal) also analysed.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Olibrius - 05-21-2007
Hello
For Egfroth, a color picture of plate Agilulf:
![[Image: agilul1forumoa2.gif]](http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/2587/agilul1forumoa2.gif)
Big picture
http://img112.imageshack.us/my.php?image=agilul1mp1.gif
A topic spangenhelm of:
http://111935.aceboard.fr/111935-543-14 ... m-vrac.htm
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Olibrius - 05-21-2007
And a article (in french) of leather work:
http://schnucks0.free.fr/garniture.htm
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - egfroth - 05-21-2007
Ooh, shiny! (shiny is GOOD!).
The other one is a record of someone's reconstruction of how the leather might have been attached and seems to make sense. However, it's not proof that it was really done that way. For that we would need leather remains actually found with the original helmet. As far as I'm aware that hasn't been found. (I could be worng - it happens occasionally).
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Agraes - 05-22-2007
For those who got issues with french
It is actually stated in the article above that some leather was found with the Krefeld-Gelep helmet, and it did help make the reconstruction.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Theodosius the Great - 05-28-2007
Quote:Theo - I've worn helmets with mail aventails for years. Never had a problem with my hair getting caught, though admittedly it's not all that long. I really can't see it being a hassle. Plenty of mediaeval re-enactors do the same, and many have really long hair. The leather is in far too good a condition to be anything but a modern addition, and I can see no reason to believe it's correct.
Historically, I'd think that when you take a blow to the neck that your hair would be enmeshed with the mail but of course that'd be the least of your problems :wink: Besides, I'd also have thought you'd need some padding so that you, the wearer, wouldn't absorb the full blow of the impact.
For reenactment purposes though, I see your point. Thanks for the tip, Steven
~Theo
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - garrelt - 05-30-2007
When i wear a helmet , i always wear a cap under it .
It helps to get a good fit for the helmet and it also takes the sweat when i'm in combat.
Mail is only a good protection against cuts, it is useless on unpadded bone-areas,arrows and bodkin like spearheads.
A padded cap(also an under garment-submaralis) or a padded aventail will prevent a bone(vertibrate) to break.
Better brused than broken.
Lose hanging long hair is even dangerous for the warrior himself, it gives something extra to
get hold of, same width long beards.
So for your safety in combat wear your long hair in pigtails.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Robert Vermaat - 06-09-2007
Quote:Don't know if it fits in with the type but, anyone have information on the horn spangenhelm from Cologne? I believe it was found in a childs grave.
My apologies for scanning the image this late, especially since we've discussed it before on RAT...
The exact dating of the grave is unclear. It may be as late as the 7th c. though. I must also say I'm a bit puzzled by the reconstruction - the holes continue around the front of the helmet..
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Marcus Mummius - 06-09-2007
Great picture Robert, thanks for posting it.
The reconstruction offered by deepeeka isn't good at al, like you said. It should have leather edging and no metal hinges.
Re: Reconstructing a 6th c. Baldenheim spangenhelm - Chuck Russell - 06-09-2007
Quote:The exact dating of the grave is unclear. It may be as late as the 7th c. though. I must also say I'm a bit puzzled by the reconstruction - the holes continue around the front of the helmet..
holes? could it be liner holes? where the liner was stitched or riveted to teh helmet itself?