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+--- Thread: Centurion shield or Scutum (/showthread.php?tid=8739)
Centurion shield or Scutum - Doc - 03-16-2007
I know that some people have their own ideas as to what equipment was used by legionaires as opposed to cavalry and that many times the evidence can go either way.
However, does anyone have any insight as to what a mid 1st century AD centruion would carry? A scutum or a shield.
I know Deepeeka sells scuta and also an oval shield they term "centurion" although as far as I know, like in many other roman weapons, there is no inscription that reads "this scutum or shield belonged to centurio....."
Any help would be appreciated
Paolo
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Marcus Mummius - 03-16-2007
I think they wore the same type of shield as the troops they were commanding.
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Matt Lukes - 03-16-2007
Ha- NEVER take what Deepeeka or any general manufacturer names things as meaning anything at all :wink: No Centurio's tombstone I know of actually shows any kind of shield, but it only makes sense that since they definitely did fight right up front with their men, they'd have one and I can't see any obvious reason it'd be any different a type.
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Crispvs - 03-16-2007
Also, don't get too hung up on the term 'scutum'. It simply means 'shield' and can be applied to any shield type, including those which have their own names.
Crispvs
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Gaius Julius Caesar - 03-16-2007
Cant argue there! :roll: The oval scutum touted as a 'Centurions', by many vendors, is a large, flat, 3/4" plywood block. Heavy and big!
If a Centurion was to use something different, I cant imagine one going for a monstrosity like that!
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Hibernicus - 03-17-2007
What vendors say: Heck, even I ask / insist that my customers seek the advice and opinion of others even though anything I sell must meet LEGIO IX HISPANA standards.
Scutum size.... I always found it intimidating and a respect earner when I could show a guy half my age that my scutum was beefier than his.
"Maybe when you grow up boy you can learn to use a man's scutum!"
My current scutum was tested against a pilum and the pilum bounced off, leaving a small pyramidal indent. Think how an enemy would feel seeing his arrows and darts bounce off of or barely stick into the scutum of that guy standing in front!
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Gaius Julius Caesar - 03-17-2007
Well, I wonder how they over came the nerve damage caused by scutums/segmentata's? the heavier the scutum, the bigger the problem I would imagine! there must have been methods of construction and wood combos used that we arn't privy to these days! Seems a lot of people go for the brute force and ignorence when many items were of a more refined construction. What does your scutum weigh Sean? Would humping for 17 miles a day with it be feasible? Those little Romans were pretty tough, compared to us, but I wonder how they over came problems like that? It makes me think that a bigger effort must have been taken to ensure a seg fit the wearer, because I can't imagine lasting too long having to fight with a dead hand. Mind you, 25 years in the patch would be the equivelent to the end of legionaries service/life.... :lol: :?
Will see how i cope with my Republican scutum, which is finally ready! Only a year and a half in the making! I hope it's good! :lol:
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Doc - 03-18-2007
Byron,
Who made your scutum
Thanks
Paolo
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Gaius Julius Caesar - 03-18-2007
Hey Paolo,
a guy in Spain, the website is Armillum, associated with Armae in France.
He hand paints any design on them, so it is going to be a surprise, I wanted one for Caesars Xth, but there is no real evidence for a scutum emblem, so a little artistic licsence no doubt.
My other scutum is by Len Morgan, which is the one I am using for the XIIIIth impression.
Hope that is enough info?
regards
Byron
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Tarbicus - 03-18-2007
Quote:a guy in Spain, the website is Armillum, associated with Armae in France.I've bought from Jorge Mambrillo at Armillum a number of times and have been very satisfied with the items.
http://armillum.com/tienda/
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Doc - 03-18-2007
Thank you Jim and Byron. That is good information. I am trying to get a scutum with a relief design on it. However, if someone like these places you both mentioned, can paint well, then I could go with that as well.
Where can I get good scutum designs. I know the one from Dan Peterson however, too many people have copied this. I was looking for something with a laurel wreath.
Thanks again
Paolo
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Peroni - 03-18-2007
Quote:I know the one from Dan Peterson however, too many people have copied this.
That's because it is one of the very very few designs that can actually be attributed to a particular legion - in this case the XIIII GMV.
Have a look toward the back of the book, I'm sure there's a laurel wreath design there. (One of the German groups IIRC Possibly VIII AVG?)
Shield - Graham Sumner - 03-18-2007
Hello Paolo
The shield device used by Legio II AVG is based on the one shown on the Arch of Orange, carried incidentally by a figure identified by Robinson as a centurio!
Graham.
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Gaius Julius Caesar - 03-18-2007
I bought my belt and gladius from jorge, as well as my paenula, Jim, and was happy with them, although the gladius was the deepeeka mainz with which there are a few issues. :roll:
Originally the Rep scutum came with a wooden boss, but he had a problem with his carpenter, which delayed it significantly, plus deciding on the design, as none are attributed to caesars Xth. :? ? D D evil: :evil:
Re: Centurion shield or Scutum - Doc - 03-19-2007
Thank you all for the help.
Peroni, thanks for the info. I am aware however, that Dan Peterson' s shield emblem is one of the very very few finds. I was inferring if there was one other than his.
Mr. Sumner thank you also. I will check that presently. This would be Legio II Aug in England (just checking).
Paolo