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+--- Thread: tribune helmet (/showthread.php?tid=7545)
tribune helmet - Marcus Mummius - 11-25-2006
Salvete,
What helmet that has been excavated would be suitable for a tribune impression from the first century AD? Or is such a helmet not known? I do not want to base myself completely on sculptural evidence...
Thanks in advance,
Valete,
Re: tribune helmet - Matthew Amt - 11-25-2006
No confirmed tribune's helmet has been excavated, so unfortunately artwork is all you have. Many others have gone before you, into the depths of speculation, stylization, and ambiguity. Have a nice trip!
The one possible exception is an absolutely whacked out piece shown in Robinson, and reconstructed in one of the Osprey books. It's an old Etrusco-Corinthian, the type that looks like a Classical Corinthian pushed up onto the head, so there are fake eyes and nasal high up on your forehead. Down the back of this one is a 3-layer articulated neckguard made to look like laurel wreaths! The whole thing is gilded. It's fabulous, bizarre, and nothing like the traditional Attic helmet. Of course, we can't prove it's a tribune's helmet.
But to add a little on the "plus" side of the evidence, the spiffy decorated helmet from Thielenhofen, though probably much later, is still sort of Attic in general shape, so it might give you something firmer to go on than just the rotten Louvre relief.
Good luck and Vale,
Matthew
Re: tribune helmet - Tarbicus - 11-25-2006
Cesar posted this new one from Armae.
link from old RAT
Any use?
Re: tribune helmet - Tarbicus - 11-25-2006
There's also this maybe?:
[url:1p0fiyef]http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?p=105476#105476[/url]
One thing I will say is that there's a fantastic statue in a book called Imperium Legionis, by Jose Sanchez Toledo. The statue is on the credits page opposite the front Index; a set of decorative musculata with pteryges, and a corking crested helmet not a million miles from the Nix consul helmet. The cheek pieces extend all the way under the chin and meet solidly in the middle under the chin. If anyone knows anymore about this statue I'd appreciate it, as the only description for it is "Roman marble sculpture representing a high official". :roll:
Re: tribune helmet - Peroni - 11-25-2006
The helmet Matt writes about is the rather strange piece of kit found at Autun.
Here...
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b242/ ... helmet.jpg
Re: tribune helmet - Marcus Mummius - 11-26-2006
Quote:The helmet Matt writes about is the rather strange piece of kit found at Autun.
Here...
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b242/ ... helmet.jpg
That thing looks so fragile...
Is there a depiction known of a high ranking officer wearing a masked helmet (like the one from Kalkriese)?
Could the attic helmet, like the one from deepeeka be used?
Vale,
Re: tribune helmet - Tarbicus - 11-26-2006
Quote:That thing looks so fragile...Thing is, our helmets are invariably too robust and made from heavier gauge than original items, from what I can tell (shield bosses especially). It's probably no more fragile than a real Gallic G?
Re: tribune helmet - Marcus Mummius - 11-26-2006
Quote:Quote:That thing looks so fragile...Thing is, our helmets are invariably too robust and made from heavier gauge than original items, from what I can tell (shield bosses especially). It's probably no more fragile than a real Gallic G?
Yes, I agree completely. I just think the tips of those feathers wouldn't last very long when I'd wear this helmet
The cheekplates look very thin too. Very nice helmet though.Is deepeeka also going to improve their attic helmet and the sport mask helmets?
Re: tribune helmet - Tarbicus - 11-26-2006
Quote:Is deepeeka also going to improve their attic helmet and the sport mask helmets?I don't recall the Attic helmet being looked at, which given comments of late they might be better making an Italic A. The facemasks have been halved in weight though, addressed by Peronis while he was there.
Re: tribune helmet - MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS - 11-26-2006
I must say i do love the attic etrusco corinthian helmet!!!
a good candidate!!!
I must say i am surprised about the low prices for these helmets since when i started this kind of re-enactment a nigel Cluff helmet was said to be 2000 guilders so about 1000 Euros
M.VIB.M.
Re: tribune helmet - Marcus Mummius - 11-26-2006
Quote:I must say i do love the attic etrusco corinthian helmet!!!
a good candidate!!!
I must say i am surprised about the low prices for these helmets since when i started this kind of re-enactment a nigel Cluff helmet was said to be 2000 guilders so about 1000 Euros
M.VIB.M.
The good people from Armae showed me pictures of this helmet about a month ago. It's very nice and I'd seriously consider it was it not that this prototype is a very large helmet. Too large for my head.
The following helmets will probably be even better (both in accuracy and in size). I hope they don't get a lot more expensive...
Vale,
Re: tribune helmet - Uwe Bahr - 11-27-2006
Hi Jef / Marcus,
I think a good candidate would be also the type that is called Hellenistic or Thracian. There are at least some reliefs that show this type and last but not least - take a look on the statue of Drusus from the Cagliari Museum / Italy below.
It is not very good visible in the background, but this is one of only very few depictions of helmets on temporary statues. Also, the gear of Drusus is typical for what we nowadays imagine when we think of tribunes: not too decorated and rather simple, probably of that type which was really worn in battle.
An original helmet of that type probably would have looked like the helmet from the Louvre Museum, Paris, find spot Tombak (wherever this may be).
BTW, Jim AKA Tarby,
I think the statue came from Rhodos. It is also depicted in Peter Connolly's 'Hannibal and the Enemies of Rome', but there is also not much information about the statue, and was also model for Osprey's 'Armies of the Carthaginian Wars'. But I don't have them at the hand now.
Greets - Uwe
Re: tribune helmet - Marcus Mummius - 11-27-2006
Thanks Uwe!
Do you have a link to a picture of the so called thracian and hellenistic type you mean?
You don't mean this kind of helmet do you?:
![[Image: 551.jpg]](http://www.nortonarmouries.com/images/upload/imagestore/image450x450/551.jpg)
Kind regards,
Jef
Re: tribune helmet - Theodosius the Great - 11-27-2006
Uwe,
That Thracian helmet really is a good candidate :!: If the "visor" were turned up-side-down the helmet would look almost like the real thing : see ?
D D D D D D D D D D D D D ![[Image: thracian.jpg]](http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y25/RCasti998/thracian.jpg)
Actually, the crestbox, neckguard, and bowl shape would still make it a Greek version of an attic :wink:
Quote: I do not want to base myself completely on sculptural evidence...
Unfortunately, as Matt said, that's all we have. Same is true for the lorica musculata which compliments this helmet.
Theo
Re: tribune helmet - MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS - 11-28-2006
NICE WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
M.VIB.M.