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+---- Thread: Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass (/showthread.php?tid=23849)
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Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Bilarius - 04-30-2014
Hello, i have formed and built a leather chest piece, i would like to decorated it,
similar to this
http://s2.glbimg.com/QQ0Kb8LtKeShn0PvoTHBIEbAsh0_XmQ80K2QndBfZxL2dqUPhzhC4irDRhf6Jw3o/i.glbimg.com/og/ig/f/original/2013/03/05/marcus_crassus_39872.jpg
it does not have to be exact, is there any websites where you can purchase items that can be used for armor?
Thank you!
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Flavivs Aetivs - 04-30-2014
Uh... not trying to bring this debate up again, but Leather Musculata is a complete and total fantasy.
Not trying to put you down, but I hope you don't plan to go reenacting with it bro.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Bilarius - 04-30-2014
No its for a church performance, and the actor is a veteran with a really bad back so he cant wear anything to heavy and he really wants to look good in his part.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Dan Howard - 04-30-2014
Historical leather armour was a lot heavier than metal armour. Most bronze cuirasses only weigh 4-5 kg.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Dan D'Silva - 04-30-2014
For a costume, I wouldn't worry about historical weights -- if the cuirass is light enough for the actor, that's fine. Some metallic paint might be in order though.
Hey Dan, didja catch that thread over at TWC where a guy was arguing that most legionaries wore leather musculatas? Disturbing, but kinda funny.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Dan Howard - 05-01-2014
Quote:Hey Dan, didja catch that thread over at TWC where a guy was arguing that most legionaries wore leather musculatas? Disturbing, but kinda funny.
I didn't see the actual thread but I'm guessing that this was what was discussed here.
http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=30001
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - PhilusEstilius - 05-01-2014
I think this kind of topic about a leather cuirass has been chased around on many occasions but to say it is fantasy is indeed a rather bold statement to make and I would really like to read the evidence that proves that such a statement.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Flavivs Aetivs - 05-01-2014
Quote:For a costume, I wouldn't worry about historical weights -- if the cuirass is light enough for the actor, that's fine. Some metallic paint might be in order though.
Hey Dan, didja catch that thread over at TWC where a guy was arguing that most legionaries wore leather musculatas? Disturbing, but kinda funny.
Yeah... that was a fun debate :dizzy:
@PhiliusEstus
I don't want to start a debate like that again. But the evidence is the lack of evidence, as well as the logic.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Dan D'Silva - 05-01-2014
Quote:I didn't see the actual thread but I'm guessing that this was what was discussed here.Hm... I don't think so, unless it's a continuation elsewhere -- the discussion I was thinking of was locked in February. I would provide a link to it, but it's very... ugh. (Why is there no forehead-slap emoticon?)
http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=30001
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - jvrjenivs - 05-01-2014
Quote:it does not have to be exact, is there any websites where you can purchase items that can be used for armor?
http://www.artecialone.it/
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Flavivs Aetivs - 05-01-2014
Dan (Howard) you've seen the discussion. I posted it on FAR.
And yes, that discussion does make me look like an idiot. I didn't really have nothing but stubbornness to fight the guy with, and some basic Google-ing.
I have a copy of Karen and Dixon's Roman Imperial Arms and Armor to hit him over the head with now, and he still brings it up all the frickin time in other threads.
It lasted EXACTLY 1 year and yes I did get so pissed that I lied about the ballista towards the end. We have actually tested that thing but it was a decade ago and I wasn't around, although I've worn the maile it was tested on.
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?589522-Leather-Musculata
And another decent chunk of it here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?434509-The-Tavern/page362
And there's quite a few more bits of it in that "The Tavern" Thread if you go back a ways, but ain't nobody got time for that.
EDIT: Even reading the thread is brutal.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Dan Howard - 05-01-2014
Quote:Dan (Howard) you've seen the discussion. I posted it on FAR.Ahh. Nope, don't remember it. Must have blanked it from my memory
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Dan D'Silva - 05-01-2014
Really, Evan, I thought you were one of the saner voices there. (And I don't even have a position on that debate... Imperial Rome isn't my field.)
Bill, where are you located? Depending on how much work versus how much money you want to put into this project, you might consider making tooled leather fittings, if you already have the capacity to wet-form the basic cuirass.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Flavivs Aetivs - 05-01-2014
Trust me, that was a year of brutal non-stop argument. In the end, they basically screwed themselves over when they basically admitted to it being a (as Matt Amt once put it) "fetish." Then the thread got locked.
I'm not averse to leather garments entirely, just not leather Musculata. We know Leather lamellar was around in some of the eastern provinces, but it wasn't common though.
Metal pieces for Leather Cuirass - Alexand96 - 05-01-2014
A notice to Evan (and to all who would doubt, for that matter),
The Romans not only had leather cuirasses, they practically ONLY had leather armor! In fact, what you all don't realize is that the remains of metallic armor are just an aberration...a fluke! Any true Roman who could see modern reenactors marching around in their shining plate armor would laugh himself silly at the thought that men entering battle wouldn't want to be attired in the best Italian leather money can buy!! I mean honestly, who wouldn't want a Gucci musculata?!? For God's sake man - just look at the infamous "bend"!!
Alright, I've laid the bait....any takers?? :evil:
In all honesty, although I am a hardcore anti-leather guy for armor proper, I do believe the Romans used it for backing and in their subarmalis construction. There, we have some evidence (squamata backing from Dura), there, we have some logical progression (I remember Travis Clarke arguing that the Roman panoply with muscled cuirass originates from Greek tradition, i.e. the Greek muscled cuirass and tube and yoke) of the Greeks using leather for ptyruges (if you accept the spolas=leather argument). But full cuirasses of leather, even boiled leather, for the Romans is just pure Hollywood fantasy based on modern views of what the past should look like.