+- RomanArmyTalk (https://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat)
+-- Forum: Research Arena (https://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/forumdisplay.php?fid=4)
+--- Forum: Allies & Enemies of Rome (https://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/forumdisplay.php?fid=10)
+--- Thread: Alan Military Tactics (/showthread.php?tid=23130)
Alan Military Tactics - Flavivs Aetivs - 09-15-2013
I'm looking for sources on Alan Military Tactics, particularly regarding their use of the feigned retreat and on their use of cataphracts. Although it is common knowledge they used both tactics, I cannot find anything published regarding the Alans.
If someone could provide some primary sources (Ammianus maybe? Possibly the strategikon?) on Alan tactics that would be great.
Alan Military Tactics - Macedon - 09-15-2013
You may want to have a look at Arrian's "Ektaxis kat' Alanon" (Array against the Alans). In his Tactica he also offers some tidbits
Alan Military Tactics - Flavivs Aetivs - 09-15-2013
I can't read Greek, do you have a link to it in English?
Alan Military Tactics - Lothia - 09-15-2013
Look at this link:
http://s_van_dorst.tripod.com/Ancient_Warfare/Rome/Sources/ektaxis.html#translation
Alan Military Tactics - Flavivs Aetivs - 09-16-2013
Thanks! This is a great link!
Alan Military Tactics - Michael Kerr - 09-16-2013
A good book with a list of primary sources is “A History of the Alans in the West" by Bernard S Bachrach. It is available to download on Scribd if you are a subscriber. On feigned retreat he mentions Arrian's array against the Alans and no one seems to know if Arrian ever had the chance to use it against Alans but he knew his stuff about cavalry tactics & how the Alans fought. Below is what the author says about “feigned retreat"
Quote:An infantry phalanx supported by use of missiles is the most effective way to stop an Alan attack. When the Alans are inundated by a shower of missiles & find they cannot shatter the infantry phalanx with their charge, they can be expected to retreat. Arrian sees this as crucial point in battle. Alans would either pick off pursuers or wheel about & attack flanks of infantry formation. Arrian sought to counter this by sending part of his cavalry in hot pursuit & keeping the other horsemen in ranks & moving them at a steady pace & infantry was to march forward slowly not breaking ranks to support his own cavalry.Regards
Michael Kerr
Alan Military Tactics - Flavivs Aetivs - 09-16-2013
Peter Heather Reccomended that book, but I am not a subscriber to scribd
Alan Military Tactics - Michael Kerr - 09-16-2013
Another good sourcebook but it is rare & expensive is “Sources on the Alans" by Agusti Alemany where he brings together 600 passages from around 200 authors from 15 countries who have had contact with Alans. Bachrach mentions that Byzantine sources provide contemporary information on Alans through Armenian & Georgian sources although I don't know if military tactics are included in these but maybe more revelant with later Roman army.
Re the Bachrach book Give me a couple of days and I shall try to convert PDF file to a text document & send it to you as The PDF is nearly 8 megabytes.
Regards
Michael Kerr
Alan Military Tactics - Alanus - 09-16-2013
Michael & Evan,
Let me know what you think of Bachrach. In some areas, he may have been a "loose canon." He made some ties that were speculative, I believe. Such as the Christening name (first name) "Alan" as deriving directly from the Alans, evidently meaning that person was descended from the Alans. My name is Alan but I have Italian-Scottish roots. :whistle:
Alan Military Tactics - Michael Kerr - 09-16-2013
Hi Alanus, he does go on a bit about Amorican Cavalry being taught by the Alans & how the Amoricans won the battle of Hastings for the Normans with their feigned retreat yet the Normans executed feigned retreats at battle of Arques in Normandy in 1053 as well as Messina in 1060 so Normans knew how to utilize this tactic without Amorican cavalry although I am sure there was an Alanic influence on their cavalry. Maybe his family originated from this area in France, but he does have an extensive Bibliography of primary sources on Alans. I know what you mean in regards to the use of the name Alan. Perhaps name Alan has Alanic origins or a nickname but not every person named Alan like yourself was an Alan, although I have a feeling that with your interests in Steppe & Central Asian history that you wouldn't mind if you could trace your ancestry to them. I copied and pasted his primary sources onto a pdf which I shall attempt to put in this post.
[attachment=7981]BibliographyOfPrimarySources.pdf[/attachment]
Hope it helps.
Regards
Michael Kerr
Alan Military Tactics - Urselius - 09-16-2013
The Alan responsible for most of the Alans of Britain was Alan Fitz Flaad. He was a Breton knight, from Dol, who was given lands in England by Henry I. He was the patrilinear ancestor of the Stuart kings of Scotland and the FitzAlan Earls of Arundel.
Alan Military Tactics - Michael Kerr - 09-16-2013
I must admit that trying to work out origin of name Alan wouldn't be easy. It could be Breton, Old Welsh, Britonic, Celtiberian or Alanic. Just glancing at Wikipedia in Breton means fox, welsh means deer & Celtiberian means deer hind. But it does appear that apart from Wales the other areas had contact with Alans at some stage. Alans & other Sarmatian groups like Aorsi & Siraces had a history of intermarrying with the elites of other nations like Bosporus Kingdom, Goths & Huns & probably Bretons.
Just on Alans I was reading that in 1238-1239 AD Mongol general Mangku defeated a coalition of Circassian & Alan armies & plundered northern Caucusus taking vast numbers of prisoners & thousands were sold to the new Sultan of Egypt, al-Salih to augment his Turkoman army & they became Mamluk cavalry & within 12 years of their capture one of their leaders Aybak founded the Burji dynasty & became first Mamluk sultan of Egypt. But I don't know if he was Alan, Cuman or Circassian. So Alans certainly got around from China, Africa, Egypt, Gaul & Spain.
[attachment=7991]image_2013-09-16.jpg[/attachment]
Posted this drawing depicting how Arrian would deploy his infantry in a charge by Alans in Dando-Collins book “Legions of Rome" just to get back on topic.
Regards
Michael Kerr
Alan Military Tactics - Flavivs Aetivs - 09-16-2013
Adrian Goldsworthy uses that image in "Complete Roman Army."
Alan Military Tactics - Flavivs Aetivs - 09-16-2013
I found in Bachrach a reference to the use of "Heavy Lancers" by the Alans (along with several to the feigned retreat) and he refers back to Arrian's Tactica. Anyone know of an online copy of that?
Here is a passage from Ammianus on Hun tactics:
"enter battle drawn up in wedge-shaped masses, while their medley of voices makes a savage noise. And as they are lightly equipped for swift motion, and unexpected action, they purposely divide suddenly into scattered bands and attack, rushing about in disorder here and there, dealing terrific slaughter; and because of their extraordinary rapidity of movement . . . they fight from a distance with missiles . . . they gallop over the intervening spaces and fight hand to hand with swords."
Ammianus Marcellinus, XXXI, 2, 9.
Here is one from Arian regarding the Alan's tendency to retreat when faced with heavy missile fire, something that may have played a role at Chalons due to the Hunnic Horse-Archers:
Arrian Extaxis:
"...and the whole missile rain must be coming from all sides to make it concentrated enough to panick the horses and destroy the enemies. And the expectation is that the Scythians will not get close to the infantry battle formation because of the tremendous weight of missiles."
Arrian Tactica:
"Roman horsemen carry their lances and strike the enemy in the same manner as do the Alans and the Sarmatians"
These are great passages - I have the first two, but need the third.
Alan Military Tactics - Macedon - 09-17-2013
In his Tactica Arrian mentions the Alans twice.
"δορατοφόροι μὲν οἱ πελάζοντες ταῖς τάξεσι τῶν πολεμίων καὶ δόρασιν ἀπομαχόμενοι ἢ κοντοῖς ἐν τῇ ἐπελάσει ἐξωθοῦντες ὡς Ἀλανοὶ καὶ Σαυρομάται" 4.3.
doratophoroi (spearbearers) are those who approach the array of the enemy and fight with dorata or kontoi spears stabbing at them as they charge, like the Alans and the Sarmatians.
"Ῥωμαίοις δὲ οἱ ἱππεῖς οἳ μὲν κοντοὺς φέρουσιν, καὶ ἐπελαύνουσιν ἐς τὸν τρόπον τὸν Ἀλανικὸν καὶ τῶν Σαυροματῶν" 4.7.
Of the Romans, some are armed with kontoi spears and charge in the manner that the Alans and the Sarmatians do...
This is the info given by Arrian in his Tactica.