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What helmet is this? - Printable Version

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What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 04-13-2004

Hey guys,<br>
<br>
On the X Gemina site from the Netherlands, one of their sagittari are using this helmet:<br>
<br>
<img src="http://img13.photobucket.com/albums/v39/TlantMagnus/Gemina_Archer.jpg" style="border:0;"/><br>
<br>
What kind is it? Can and is it made of multiple pieces riveted together? Could a reconstruction be made of multiple pieces? <p>Magnus/Matt<br>
Legio XXX "Ulpia Victrix"<br>
Niagara Falls, Canada</p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Robert Vermaat - 04-13-2004

You mean an early Spangenhelm?<br>
<br>
Valete,<br>
Valerius/Robert <p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Vincula - 04-13-2004

Quote:</em></strong><hr>What kind is it?<hr><br>
Looks like the Bryastovets helmet in Sofia Museum, Bulgaria. <p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 04-13-2004

I don't think it's a spangenhelm, but it sure looks like it. They're a 1st century unit.<br>
<br>
Vincula, are there any pictures of the original on the net? I don't think it's commercially available, perhaps they had it custom made. <p>Magnus/Matt<br>
Legio XXX "Ulpia Victrix"<br>
Niagara Falls, Canada</p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Vincula - 04-13-2004

I think they've copied Russel Robinson's reconstruction, which I just posted on a different thread. Here it is again:<br>
<img src="http://members.aol.com/romanwriter1/archer.jpg" style="border:0;"/> <p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 04-13-2004

Do you know offhand if it is constructed of one piece or several? <p>Magnus/Matt<br>
Legio XXX "Ulpia Victrix"<br>
Niagara Falls, Canada</p><i></i>

What helmet is this? - NightHunter24 - 04-13-2004

Was this not the type of helmets the Hamian(?) archers in Roman service used to use? <p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Daniel S Peterson - 04-13-2004

Nighthunter,<br>
This appears to be a close copy of the hypothetical, conical, west asian archer helmet in my book, which had been made by Len Morgen, formerly of the ESG and now in the "blue" British Leg XIIII. Deepeeka has also made a very similar helmet with a scale neckguard. You can see them in the Albano and Ostia reenactment threads.<br>
<br>
Similar helmets are seen on Trajan's Column and at least one tombstone. Although no spangenhelm exists that is as early as the 1st century AD, I believe they could be, because the metal Spangenhelm probably evolved from a horn version that could go back several hundred years BC. When softening and opening a cow horn you have the natural triangular shape of a spangenhelm plate. There is a helmet of this type from I believe a 6th century Frankish grave in Cologne. I have had Deepeeka copy this in real buffalo horn and it is a beautiful helmet. I'd love to make a complete scale or lamellar armor for man and horse of matching black horn plates but it would be quite expensive even in India.<br>
<br>
Dan <p></p><i></i>

What helmet is this? - NightHunter24 - 04-13-2004

Daniel,<br>
<br>
Thanks,very interesting indeed<br>
<br>
I'd have to add another question, though. Was this type of helmet specificaly used just by the archery contingent in a legion or where there other types of helmets that archers would use?<br>
<br>
<br>
<p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Daniel S Peterson - 04-13-2004

Nighthunter,<br>
I do not believe this helmet was worn exclusively by archers, but only happens to be the style worn in western asia. Therefore a normal infantry unit recruited from this region might also have this type of helmet, particularly if the unit was from a "client" state. Conical helmets were probably worn in cataphract units recruited in the east.<br>
<br>
Dan<br>
<br>
<p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 04-30-2004

As a member of Legio X, I can state that Alan (the maker and wearer of the helmet) made it from 4 peaces of iron been put together with the brass work and nails. <p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 05-01-2004

This helmet of hamian or Syrian model is highly likely based on:<br>
<br>
[url=http://www.roman-britain.org/images/housesteads_hamian.gif" target="top]www.roman-britain.org/images/housesteads_hamian.gif[/url]<br>
<br>
or any other relief depicting hamian or syrian archers more clearly....<br>
<br>
regds..<br>
<br>
M.VIB.M.<br>
<br>
<p>V COH II<br>
LEGIO X GEMINA<br>
EX GER INF</p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Vincula - 05-01-2004

Quote:</em></strong><hr>any other relief depicting hamian or syrian archers<hr><br>
I think we already established that the helmet is from the Housesteads archer.<br>
What other reliefs did you have in mind, MarcVs? <p></p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 05-02-2004

Ah yes, thanks Gaius!<br>
<br>
Was it you that I sent the email to regarding information on the auxilliary archer bows? Someone from X Gemina said they'd forward it to one of their sagittari...but I haven't heard back from them yet. <p>Magnus/Matt<br>
Legio XXX "Ulpia Victrix"<br>
Niagara Falls, Canada</p><i></i>

Re: What helmet is this? - Anonymous - 05-03-2004

No I am not the one, Tiberius. The archer of Legio X has no direct email adress. He is an expert, I will see him at the end of May. If he comes to the next event that is. Ask your question and maybe I can help. No promises, do my best... <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p200.ezboard.com/bromanarmytalk.showUserPublicProfile?gid=gauishoratiuspetrus>Gauis Horatius Petrus</A> at: 5/4/04 9:06 pm<br></i>