RomanArmyTalk
Introduction with an odd question - Printable Version

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Introduction with an odd question - eclecticmuse - 03-05-2013

Hello! Brand new to this forum and I've got a bit of an odd question for you guys that I'm not sure how to approach so I will just dive right in and get straight to the point.

I'm a Doctor Who fan and also a cosplayer. My friend and I go to conventions dressed as the characters Amy Pond and Rory Williams. Rory, at times, has been known to wear a Roman military costume on the show (he's referred to as the Lone/Last Centurion). My friend and I have decided it's time to try and attempt this costume, but--we want to do it right, and not just run off to Party City or whatever and snatch up a random (and completely wrong) Roman soldier costume.

I've already drawn on my love of Roman/Greek history and done some research to draw up what I think is a fairly accurate list of everything contained in Rory's Centurion outfit, but my knowledge only stretches so far. I think I need some expert help here, and this is where I thought I would ask you fine folks. I feel like I should disclaimer myself by saying I know his kit isn't exactly historically accurate, and that I'm aware doing this right will likely cost a good bit of $$$, but we're prepared for that. Also the searches I've done online have turned up products that look similar, but not exact. I'm willing to give a little ground in terms of exactness, but as close as possible would be preferable.

So, I guess to break this down simply: I would love for some help correctly identifying and naming all the pieces of Rory's Centurion kit, and advice/suggestions on where to purchase all the parts as cheaply but accurately as possible. Also, the more parts I can make on my own (i.e. lorica at least), the better.

Here's one picture to get us started; I've got plenty more from various angles on request. If anyone is interested in helping I can also post the item list I came up with.

[Image: rory_s5cutout_21_zps57ac5507.png]

[Image: rory_s5cutout_30_zps461c8903.png]

Thanks in advance for any help you're willing to give me and I apologize if this isn't within the rules of the forum. In the meantime, I'm heading off to the rest of the Newcomers section to see what info I can dig up. Smile


Introduction with an odd question - Tarbicus - 03-06-2013

Hi Stephanie. The gladius is the Hanwei gladius. Beware, the blade's quite sharp. I'm not sure you'd be safe or even legal carrying it around at a cosplay convention, so you'd need to check. It's not cheap, either.

(Note to RAT regulars - it's one of the nicest off-the-shelf gladii I've handled, with great balance and weight. Perhaps more like a late hispaniensis)

If you're okay with plastic armour instead of metal (hard to tell what Rory's is) look on Ebay for props/costume from the movie Alexander and you should find something similar. If you find a cuirass like it made in brass or bronze, without super-exaggerated comic book style musculature which is probably more difficult to make than a far more accurate normal body type of form (rant over), let us know :wink:

Actually, this might fit the bill for your purposes?

The helmet's what we call a Roman Trooper helmet. It's crap. An abomination. We hate it. I refuse to find a link. Google Images it :evil:


Introduction with an odd question - eclecticmuse - 03-06-2013

Quote:Hi Stephanie. The gladius is the Hanwei gladius. Beware, the blade's quite sharp. I'm not sure you'd be safe or even legal carrying it around at a cosplay convention, so you'd need to check. It's not cheap, either.

Thank you so much for replying! That's another thing I forgot to mention I'm trying to be aware of--convention friendliness and safety. But at least now that I know the name of the style, I can maybe try and and see about getting a replica made out of something lightweight and blunt. My friend and I are huge sticklers for details (something I'm sure you can appreciate!) and that scabbard, aside from being black instead of brown, is pretty much spot-on. Due to the length of it, in my research I was almost beginning to wonder if it was a spatha instead of a gladius, but the hilts were all wrong.


Quote:If you're okay with plastic armour instead of metal (hard to tell what Rory's is) look on Ebay for props/costume from the movie Alexander and you should find something similar. If you find a cuirass like it made in brass or bronze, without super-exaggerated comic book style musculature which is probably more difficult to make than a far more accurate normal body type of form (rant over), let us know :wink:

Will do! We probably won't go the metal route as that would be a death sentence by heat stroke at a con (and probably uncomfortable to boot) but, again, I guess I consider it a matter of getting a sure name on style/pattern etc and then going from there. I 'm considering talking to some friends who are members of the 501st Stormtrooper Legion and see if vacuforming might be the way to go.

(And that's another problem! His cuirass isn't defined at all, and everything I've seen online...is. :lol: )

That last one you linked miiiight work. I'm willing to bet my friend will say no based off screen accuracy but I'm bookmarking it anyway. Big Grin

I saw this and for a moment was like, "Hey, that looks pretty good!" until I realized it was the back. :oops:


Quote:The helmet's what we call a Roman Trooper helmet. It's crap. An abomination. We hate it. I refuse to find a link. Google Images it :evil:

HAHA! The helmet was giving me fits. I'd narrowed it down to about two different styles (Imperial Gallic or Italic, please forgive my ignorance if I'm waaaay off the mark) but couldn't find anything exact.

One thing I'm puzzling over is his many layers of tunic. The braccae/socks/shoes isn't too out of the ordinary for a solider in colder climates from what I've read but it's like he's got an extra layer. There's the red of his longsleeved tunic, but the orange one is what's giving me trouble. I suppose I'd just make two tunics, one longsleeved and red (and tuck that one in) and one shortsleeved and orange?

Probably won't go the wool route with that either for purposes of comfort but I'm so picky on color I'll likely find some white material and dye it myself (same for the braccae).

A variant on this I think would work great for the subarmalis and it's the closest I've found. I know I've seen this exact one on an actual website in a lighter brown color with lion's head details instead of medallions, but the bookmark is at home. I figure the waistband could just hide under the cuirass. I think the skirt goes all the way around on Rory but that may be something we'll just have to settle on.

Once again, thanks so much for your reply and sorry for rambling so much!


Introduction with an odd question - Graham Sumner - 03-06-2013

Hello Stephanie

I am a fellow Dr Who fan, so greetings. Sadly I have the Roman Auton action figure, as well as the one from the 'Fires of Pompeii' episode in which actress Karen Gillan first appeared!

They have not brought out a Rory Centurion figure yet but I will probably get that too if they do.

The layers of tunics, wearing a short sleeved tunic over a longer one, seems to be based on the film 'The Fall of the Roman Empire' and as you are probably aware Rory's outfit has more of a Hollywood look about it than an accurate one. The costume has a mixture of bought items such as those Tarbicus has pointed out and probably items from the BBC costume department with some custom made pieces.

It would appear from the sources that Romans did wear layers of clothing but normally one expects that to be of the same design. Therefore layers of short sleeved tunics or layers of long sleeved tunics and not a short sleeved tunic over a longer one.

For the filming of the two Pandorica episodes the British based group 'The Ermine Street Guard' were involved and they can briefly be seen in the first episode. However many of the Auton characters themselves, presumably extras, are wearing Roman costumes which were also previously used in the BBC series 'Ancient Rome: Rise and fall of an Empire'. These included some versions of Late Roman clothing and equipment.

As Tarbicus has also suggested it is an idea to keep an eye on EBAY for any movie props which might become available but perhaps it might also be worthwhile contacting the BBC costume department and asking for advice on the designs they used.

Yes Roman costumes were wool and metal and all re-enactors will probably agree that the more uncomfortable it is, the more accurate it is!

Best of luck in your enterprise (or should that be Tardis!)

Graham.


Introduction with an odd question - eclecticmuse - 03-06-2013

Tarbicus--Still not having any luck so far in finding a less muscular cuirass, but Google Image Search is suggesting to me that perhaps I might want to try looking at things more on the order of a Greek hoplite. Not so useful for you, unfortunately, but maybe for me. :oops:

Graham--hello fellow Whovian! Seeing as it took them as long as it did to make any sort of Rory figure to begin with I'm not holding out hope for a Centurion Rory figure. Sad

Thanks for the extra info! I've looked up the ESG. I know I tried to contact the costume designer for Who via her agent once (on another costume matter) and received no reply, but I've not tried contacting the BBC costume department in general. I'll have to go look up how to do that.

One more thing--I've contacted a few sites that carry the Hanwei gladius to see if I could purchase the scabbard separately. So far one site has said they can't but that the blade could be blunted since it's made of carbon steel. They have it on closeout for $225 which is more towards the realm of feasibility in terms of price, but I'll still keep searching for more options...


Introduction with an odd question - Athena Areias - 03-06-2013

Try costumeamour dot com. It's a theatrical/movie house and has some stuff that looks like a match to your photos.

Good luck.


RE: Introduction with an odd question - Kim Swanson - 05-30-2017

hi. i'm also trying to cobble this costume together for a museum event. i've done the war doctor and astronaut pink and think the kids would really enjoy rory the roman.

i've found the link to the original costume that was auctioned off (after the fact).

https://propstore.com/product/doctor-who/106-live-auction-2015-rory-williams-arthur-darvill-centurion-costume/

i really haven't made much progress. only a gladius and roman sandals. he also looks like he could be wearing amy's red hoodie Smile

been wanting to get the copper breastplate, shinguards, and bracers first but my two local coppersmiths are booked up.

anyhow, just glad to join the community and hope one out of our legion can muster a rory together!

-kim