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+--- Thread: Seggies! (/showthread.php?tid=19943)
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Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-11-2011
Salvette!
I was wondering where most people get their awesomely authentic and better still, FITTING seggies?? I can't stand to see gaps though.
I look at deepeeka's, and it's being improved right now, but I DO have a spending budget, which is where their's suits me. Does anyone have a decent seggie they don't need for a reasonable price or know where I can get a decent authentic and not too glamorous/cheap looking one? I'm also looking into helmets right now. I don't like the fact deepeeka's are very bowl shaped so that the cheek guards at the right angle look protruding , but that's all I see from most suppliers other than a custom $500 one... :-? What do you all mostly wear? Money is an issue these times unfortunately...
Really I'm just looking for options and seeing what's out there... info and suggestions would be gratefully appreciated as I've been searching the net for almost a week.
Sam
Re: Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-11-2011
Corbridge type seggies, and maybe coolus E - Gallic G type helmets. **
Re: Seggies! - jvrjenivs - 12-11-2011
Well, my first segmentata was made by Sean Richards of LEG IX HISP (California, USA) and my current one I made myself. Matt Lukes makes wonderful sets, although he has a long waiting list at the moment, I believe. In europe most groups have their some members who can help newbies making a new segmentata.
Edit: DSC has some better segs as well (available through Armamentaria for instance)
For a helmet, I would say a custom made is worth every bit of it. Of course there are some options between DPK and Erik Konig, which you should look into. Don't know what Matt Lukes or Whiterose armories ask for a helmet these days.
Good luck in your search.
Re: Seggies! - Gaius Colletti - 12-11-2011
Not to discourage you, but I was looking for a segmentata for about 2-3 months before I caved in and bought my Deepeeka one in July. I mean I scoured the web and even had a post in the marketplace forum on RAT and still nothing, I broke down and bought a Deepeeka one from Rusty.
Deepeeka may be working on the changes to the LS now, but it will most likely be a work in progress, I wouldn't count on the release of the new LS being in a couple of months or anything, especially since the US seems to be understandably behind our European brothers getting their equipment since there is that big ocean in the way and all
What chest size are you looking for Sam? I am a 42" and the Deepeeka LS fits me just fine. I only use a modified thick polo as a subarmalis, so I think it might fit someone a little smaller.
Re: Seggies! - Gaius Colletti - 12-11-2011
Also Sam, don't be too discouraged that Deepeeka helms have a rather round bowl, I love my Gallic H, which as you have seen in my thread about it is 8.5"x8" and I have a rather large head too, but it fits me fine.
The thing about this hobby is that we strive to have the up most accurate helmets, which is both a good and bad thing. You have to ask yourself do you want an exact replica of a particular helmet or do you want a version of a particular helmet? If the former, you might as well cross off several helmets that were found incomplete including the Guttman Gallic A as well as the Gallic H, neither were found without cheekguards, and the Gallic H from Augsburg was in horrible shape, barely worthy of having a replica made out of it, but through research of other helmets in their class replicas have been made that are considered some of the very best available. I believe a degree of speculation was taken from the Gallic I and one of the Italic H helmets too, so its not like they are in a complete mint state either. IMO there is no reason to not own a helmet because it is too round unless 1)It does not fit you comfortably or 2)You want an exact replica
Since you are trying for an early Gallic type and if you really are dead set against rounder helms, the Gallic A from Deepeeka is 8.5"x7.25" much more oval than their other helms. I didn't like it at first from the pictures, but when I got mine it is such a funny little oddball helmet, that I love it.
But don't expect a White Rose Armory, Erik Konig, or Matt Lukes helmet to be listed for $100 used, people pay hundreds of dollars for them, and do not want to part with them, at least not for much less than they paid.
This can be a very expensive hobby, so map out your priorities and budget right away
Re: Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-12-2011
I'm probably a 38 size chest, I got some filling out to do as I get older at the chest even though I'm already 6'2" 1/2 and just 16 years-old, so not too keen on buying armor. Buying sizes up is an idea, but I guess armor does cost that little over $100 more than a military belt, or a helmet, so that's out the window for this year
Unless if I can make it myself cause it's a simple task, I probably wont be buying one until Deepeeka can show me their final seggie product with a price that's not the $400 one, my priorities are on the important soldier defining aspects like the military belt. Now, I guess I just want an authentic helmet. Not really having to be a replica, like you said, one with that label has had some guesses itself. But I have turned my eye towards military belts which seem to be a higher priority for a legionary.
I'm not ruling out a helmet, but it's a tough decision. If anyone knows the best ways to start your kit on a limited budget, no more than $290 for this x-mas, please advise me as it's brain rattling. I'm thinking, a helmet is much harder to make yourself than a belt, but still what are the possibilities of finding the time and skill to make yourself a proper belt! haha...
I'm looking on the net and might reach a decision thanks for the help so far.
Sam
Re: Seggies! - richard robinson - 12-12-2011
Sam
I suggest that you constantly scour ebay (weekly)
helmets and segs do come up second hand reasonably regularly
regards
richard
Re: Seggies! - Gaius Colletti - 12-13-2011
Shop smartly and you can with some ease and patience get a nice balteus, tunic (assuming you have access to a sewing machine, caligae, a gladius, and if you are really lucky a helmet for $290... I did
Re: Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-13-2011
I have a sewing machine and can use it, I have everything I need to make anything. Anyway, my interests are branching onto another topic, and this one should die, as I'm embarrassed by my silliness.
Factors- at least for a year the only way I'll get a seggie is if I make one. I'm doodling on my cardboard right now, and I probably won't buy a helmet till then either as I'll buy them together so I don't mess up time frames.
A belt would be a nice thing for x-mas. If anything comes off this subject it can be revived, until I find anything new, looks like I'm just scouring for now.
Thanks, sam.
Re: Seggies! - Crispvs - 12-13-2011
You could make your own belt. Given the work you have already done on your sword scabbard you certainly have the skills to do it.
For simple belt plates, I seem to remember a method someone posted up a few years ago of taking three concentric brass rings, each big enough that there is a little empty space between each concentric ring and using them to emboss a simple ring onto a piece of brass to make a simple type 'B' belt plate.
First anneal a piece of thin brass cut to the right size. Next, place the largest ring on a firm surface and place the brass plate over it. Then place the medium sized ring on top of the brass plate, positioned so that when pressed into the softened plate it would sit within the ring beneath the plate. With a hammer, hit the ring sharply so that it forces the brass down into the ring below.
Anneal the plate again and then place it the other way up, with the larger ring now on top and the medium sized ring below. Take the smallest ring (which could be a solid piece or something such as a steel nut filed to round profile) and place it in the middle so that when hammered down it will push the metal in the centre down within the medium sized ring. Hit the nut sharply and when you remove the rings you should find you have embossed a nice ring onto you plate. Roll the short ends of the plate around a narrow nail or piece of wire and then all you have to do is punce four holes through the plate.
Once you have done this you should have a perfectly acceptable belt plate which will have taken you a surprisingly short time to make. You should be able to make all the plates you need in an evening. You could buy a buckle from a variety of sources or, if you were keen you could make one from bone yourself. Make cut-outs in the rolled end of one of the plates to create the hinge for the buckle.
There are one or two other simple tutorials for making belt plates on RAT as well.
Whichever one you choose there is no reason why you could not have a decent military belt by Christmas which you have made yourself. In comparison to the work you have already done on your scabbard, I sure you would find it very easy to make your own belt.
There is nothing for you to feel embarrassed about by the way. There is no such thing as a stupid question and nothing you have said or asked has been silly. I think it is true to say that all of us here are VERY impressed with what you have achieved. In a very short time you have rapidly achieved things which many other people have taken years to achieve. If you carry on the way you have been doing over the last three or four months you could quickly come to be amongst the best craftsmen here on RAT and you could easily find that other people would start to ask you to make things for them when they see what you are capable of. You have nothing at all to be embarrassed about Sam. I say - keep up the good work. You have a lot to be proud of!
Crispvs
Re: Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-13-2011
THANK YOU SO much Crispvs, you should have seen the blush when my mum decided to read. But now you have convinced her that I am capable of such craftsmanship and possibly removed her constant questioning whether one day my sword will fall lose and hit my foot... :roll: I'll take this as a challenge, and I shall set on making my own. If not before Christmas, maybe by new years
I need a terminal knob for my chape, and a pommel for my handle. Then secure the cross hangers to the scabbard itself and possibly a plate under the lower cross hanger would be appropriate. I've been thinking all day of a design I remember about your door handle method and shall leave that as possibly the finishing touch on the completion. I have sent photos back to my grandparents in Scotland, as I'm born and half raised there, so I'm sure they'll like a belt too I really appreciate your reply, and I'll remember this method, as it strikes me as simple, but stunningly attractive. I like on SOTW the "bulls eye" belt plate.
Anyway, happy holidays everyone , and will keep you posted!
Regards, Samuel
Re: Seggies! - jkaler48 - 12-13-2011
Sent you a PM about a older helmet that needs a repair that you could do.
Re: Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-14-2011
PM replied.
Re: Seggies! - Ward - 12-14-2011
Hi. This is my first post here and it looks like a good and supportive board.
I am a blacksmith and I decided to do a Seggie. I'm settled on the Colridge B pattern and I wanted to be able to look at some pics and read about a build. I have a cardboard Seggie build and it seems to fit well. I think I am just about ready to do the metal cutting. I am planning 18 ga. mild steel all around. I would kind of like to do some brass piping on some of the edges, but I can't seem to find the piping. I also have a question about the back plates. How much overlap should they have?
Anyway, thanks for letting me post here.
Re: Seggies! - Titus Marius Secundus - 12-14-2011
Hello Rob and a warm welcome to RAT!!!
Here is the perfect place to ask if you're making a seggie for the first time. I am trying to finish my cardboard mock-up right now. Best instructional site to visit is http://www.larp.com/legioxx/lorica.html .
Tell me, did you consider wearing your subarmalis and tunic with the lorica on? So leave at least an inch of spare room inside. It's advised to get hold of your tunic and subarmalis and then fit your cardboard mock-up ( really just the waist plates) based around your width while wearing.
Can you wear dressing gowns to compensate for the size of a tunic and subarmalis anyone?
Anyway, the back plates, a quarter of an inch. I wouldn't say any less, nor much more. I would ask someone like M.Demetrius, or Matt Ampt ( if you're reading this please help) for some tips. Everything that you should need to know are basically listen on the Legio XX site. As you can see, in some pictures on that page, some plates have the corners cut off. Well that's at least an 1/8th of an inch angle, and it covers the cut-off above it, so AT LEAST an eighth of an inch, to 1/4.
Brass piping I found at my local Ace Hardware store. It was at the back of the store, and is for model making by K&S. If you live in the USA you can check it out. You may also order it online. If they don't have any, tell them another store had some and was wondering if they could order you some. You might only want 1/8th inch or narrower if possible pipe. Here I have a selection of that, up to an inch! Maybe good for a scutum!!! 18 gauge is a good selection, but there is archaeological samples which some debate that are more like 20 gauge. When we're talking bout strength, that's what makes or breaks!
Anyway, I suggest you give us all your updates, and maybe even a picture of your cardboard mock-up, as we're, or I'm interested in seeing anything! Please maybe start your own topic under "Roman re-enactment and re-construction" as then we won't anger anyone at the complexity of this topic. :oops:
Here is a link to Ventus Draconis's blog http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat.html?func=view&catid=20&id=292220 and his "non-RAT" blog...http://galeforcearmoury.blogspot.com/
He hasn't done anything recently, but maybe you can get an idea and learn about his mistakes making the hinges more than you can learn from finished result pictures. His last post titles, " Not Dead Yet" but...idk :roll: I hope he hasn't given up on his Newstead!!! Note his is a Newstead so don't imitate!
Hope this helps some
]Regards, Sam.