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Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Theodosius the Great - 09-29-2010
From the BBC :
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11424110
A museum in Rome is turning to reenactors to help attract visitors.
Why did it take this long to come up with this idea ?
~Theo
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - LvpvsRomanvs - 10-06-2010
This is a really good idea. Although I myself don't really find museums boring, this will really improve the experience for people that do. I think I may be right in thinking that the re-enactors here are from the Italian XXX Vlpia Victrix group.
- Lorenzo/Virilis
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Robert - 10-06-2010
It never ceases to amaze me how slow musea are in catching on to the fact that modern people yearn for stories unfolding before them, instead of having to put their own imagination to use trying to figure out how all that dusty stuff in a showcase would have been used in actual, ancient life. There is so much to be won! The Archeon in the Netherlands made a gallant attempt, and living history parks all around Europe demonstrate the success. For the themepark Noviolocus, Museum het Valkhof in Nijmegen has expressed their wish to join in an educational joint venture to show the story both indoors and out. No cross finance, mind you, just a solid working partnership with each doing what their core business is, but providing a full package all the same. Re-enactment can significantly lower the threshold for museum attendance. So yes, I applaud this museum's effort to provide a better insight into Roman life and elevating their collection to a new level of understanding, without detracting from their main goal, exhibiting finds in the best possible way.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS - 10-06-2010
Accurate ?
entertaining for sure, but the rest of the news item is a load of nonsense.
M.VIB.M.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Robert - 10-07-2010
Did I say "accurate" ? You are missing the point. I am not commenting on that haphazard display of shieldbashing, which I think is a crock of shit anyway, as it has nothing to do with combat. I am saying musea and re-enactment go together very well in telling the public a more complete story and it amazes me so few musea realise this.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Tiberio-Tertio - 10-07-2010
Well I guess it is also a feeling of trust, as some museums have had people that treated the museum like a kind of Disneyland, or worse, thinking of certain open-air museums where there are buildings with thatched roofs and still some feel they have to smoke even though they know the museum is edgey about the fire hasard.
Museums have to feel they are dealing with relayable people, people who also know, that it can not be taken for granted, that one is allowed to set up ones display on museum grounds. It takes time to get a door open in a museum, it takes just one nut, seen doing something daft to shut that door that took so long to open.
That is why it is not easy to be allowed to do something in a museum. And I do not blame them, as who would want unreplaceable artefacts destroyed because of some silly costume campers?
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Robert - 10-07-2010
You are right in musea being cautious and rightly so. But the "extra" does not have to take place inside the museum at all. The thing is the "joint venture" to create the story. Our proposed location is 10 kilometers removed from the museum, but for a busload of schoolkids, setting up a joint programm is very feasable, each party doing it's own thing. Also, there is often some space in front of the museum or in the courtyard or elswhere, it is mainly the will (or rather the lack of it on the part of the musea) to join forces. The rest is practical considerations and needs to be tailored each time anyway.
I remember an exhibition on the Vikings where just a few re-enactors/archeology students acted as museum guides, offering explanation on the exhibits on display and answering questions about their clothing and personal effects. There was a Viking tent/encampment outside and every hour or so a small display. It attracted a lot of visitors and it made the visit so much more exciting to the visitors, being able to interact.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Tiberio-Tertio - 10-07-2010
Oh there are museums that will open their doors, I know a few of them, for exampe the Fränkisches Freiland Museum in Bad-Windsheim, have been their for over ten years now, and I think it has been for both sides a very good partnership. But it took lots of time until the museum trusted us. The first few events we would have museum staff popping up at all possibile times to see what we where doing. I have seen one group at the Freilichtmuseum Kommern that got into serious trouble because cigarette butts where found on the attic of a house which had a thatched roof, and it was a known fact that the museum wished for no smoking in the houses. The events at the roman museum at Haltern has been going on for years now in front of the museum no problems at all. Same goes for the open air museums Saalburg, Xanten and Funkenburg. So yes it is possible, and yes there can be great events done at museums, but it is a long process to earn the trust of museums to be allowed set up at a museum. As there are many that call themselves "reenactors" but have a far easy goinger attitude to museum facillities than others. So to a certain extent I can understand why museums have a reserved attitude, but also in a lot of responsible positions at various museums younger people have moved in that have a more open mind towards new ideas, and do not think as conservative as their older colleages.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS - 10-07-2010
Musea working together with living history people, experimental archaeologists et cetera is of course a thing to be supported and applauded.
However, a museum should ask for people who are ACCURATE. Their reconstructions should be acceptable to the scientific world, their explanation to the audiences should be thorough and true to the letter, and even if some things remain unclear, should be didactical and sound.
Bashing shields is not such a thing, the equipment of the soldiers (especially the blue shielded ones) is ridiculous and bad. I do not know enough about theatre to comment on the show which was given.
Re-enactors who take their hobby serious, and who have proved beyond a doubt they are accurate and correct in their equipment (as far as reconstructions of original material go, should work alongside museums. Just like we help Deepeeka bettering their stuff, just like we are in close connection to Daniyal and other makers, we should also try and be in touch with the musea of the world... Here in the Netherlands things have been going quite well for years now, regarding contact between musea and re-enactment groups of high standard, as well as scolarly support and help where needed, sometimes even access to unpublished finds can be granted, but not enough to my personal liking (referring to the post in which i mentioned the Archaological provincial depot in Alphen, full of unpublishes military finds)
Theme parks are possible, and some are indeed very good in their intentions, however if commerciality takes over, accuracy goes down the drain, cf. Archeon where even the Latin words accompanying photos of pugiones et cetera are misspelled and dead wrong.
A lot of work can, and must, still be done.
M.VIB.M.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Tiberio-Tertio - 10-07-2010
Ah yes museum magazines are the biggest treat one can get if one is allowed to have a peek what they have stored in the magazines, as most museums have only 1/4 of their artefacts on public display! Yes you are right Archeon has a bit of a reputation as a "history-Disneyland" Themeparks are usually more on the look out for maximum profits, so accuracy often enought falls under the table. Most open air museums in Germany will not allow any "costume campers" on their grounds. The museum officials need a lot of convincing before they let anyone on their grounds, and they are right in doing so! It is enought that the media shows plenty of the shaddy sides of the hobby, don´t need that in museums.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Robert - 10-07-2010
Hmm, now there is an interesting point, although this may swerve the thread off track a bit. As soon as the German governement cuts back on the lavish subsidies of open-air historical parcs, we may see a sudden shift in the lack of love for "costume campers" (great frase!!), then suddenly seen as a welcome means of attracting visitors and staying open.
A certain extent of commerciality is needed to balance the budget, but I fully agree this should never be an excuse for wrong information or obvious misspelling.
Now, I have seen the re-enactment scene progress over the years, but there is a lot we just do not know. This makes one interpretation just about as good as the other, if not based on solid facts. Many re-enactors doing first century wear large, wide, third century style pugiones, just because they were and are available at a decent price. Having re-enactors re-enact re-enactors leads to false "truth" being defended touch and claw. Many a high horse statement about accuracy is totaly unsupported or based on a lot of conjunction, and musea are often no better in their judgement. So we should as a community work at decreasing the amount of "costume campers", but to be quite frank, most of the public (99.6% ?) couldn't care less if the pugio worn was first or third centry, all they remember is the Roman soldier carried a pretty, big knife and their little boy was allowed to briefly hold it, totally making his day.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Tiberio-Tertio - 10-07-2010
Hmm I don´t know if various theme parks here in Germany are supported by the government? I hope not!! But then again they do enjoy wasting tax money on a lot of loony things. Just need to think of commercial parks like that terrible "Adventon" (fantasy here we come). Yes there is still a lot to improve just need to think of those standard shoes that almost everyone wears, reguardless be they Romans, Celts, Germanics, even Vikings, and some so called medieval "reenactors", a real eye sore! As to the general public, well those that do make the effort to go to a museum wish to be correctly informed, so I do not think "couldn't care less if the pugio worn was first or third centry" that is right with these people, but you would be right on many that visit so called "historical festivals" these people wish for entertainment, and don´t really care about the details. At least that is what I have seen now over many years.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Robert - 10-07-2010
Well, Xanten for one is very heavily subsidized. You make an interesting statement about " people going to a museum want to be correctly informed" . Yes, they do, but very few people actually visit a museum and that is the point I am trying to make. There is no need to mis-inform the public (although we knowingly and unknowingly do so all the time), but musea can benift from stepping down off there scientificly elevated hobby-horses and making a visit to the museum more entertaining. This will surely attract a wider public by lowering the initial threshold.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - Marcus Octavian - 10-12-2010
As much as some of us like to visit museums, there are quite a few that find them boring. Myself, and others I know love to do our own research and learning things for ourselves. Unfortunately though, we are a tv/internet generation. History is easier learned now by watching television shows, or clicking video links on a web page. Less and less people are willing to do the "foot work" themselves. Which is a huge shame in my opinion. I personally have always loved that feeling of...well discovery when I would find a great resource material or paper with the focus of my interest at the moment.
There used to be these things made of paper with words on them at one time, I think they were known as "books", that had not just wonderful pictures in them, but the words of people that were so passionate about the subject, they would jot them down for those of us that wanted them.
To sum up, I prefer to find info that doesn't have "wiki" in the title.
But with so many museums closing all over the world, due to lack of interest or lack of funds, I would have to say I support the ones that have finally taken steps to try to insure that their place stays open. If myself, my children, and anyone else now or future have to rely on the antics of a dedicated group of weekend warriors, that throw on a lorica, bad trooper helm, and "roman shoes" to keep the doors open, well I for one can't nit-pick them.
Re: Video : Museum brings ancient Rome to life - scott - 10-12-2010
Hear hear John, I think that sums it up nicely.