Leather belt construction - Printable Version

Leather belt construction - Printable Version

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Leather belt construction - Marcus Mummius - 11-14-2008

Salvete,

We know the Romans often used several layers of leather to make the belt for a balteus.

They often used thin leather and joined pieces so both the front and the back of the belt would be smooth. Often a piece of linen fabric was put between the leather to make the construction stronger and make the belt more resistant to stretching.

Several techniques can be used to achieve this.

The simplest is taking two pieces of leather and sewing them together with the rough sides to the inside. This however results in edges that aren't very clean.

Another technique is to use two pieces and folding the edges to the inside. This way you have a neater edge, but you clearly see that two pieces of leather were used.

Another technique consists of using a piece of leather for the front that is wider than the piece for the back. The edges of the front piece of leather can be folded over the narrower back piece. This way you have nice round edges, but the seem is clearly visible on the back of the belt.

There must be yet another technique. This is one I do not understand. You can see this on the belts made by Erik Konig from Aurificina Treverica. The following pictures can be found on his website:

[Image: 181506011108_rmg7.jpg]

On this last belt you can see how the zone where the apron is attached is cut open and the apron is inserted between the two layers of leather.

How in earth is this done? Smile

You can clearly see that the belts consist out of two layers of leather, both the front and back are the smooth side of the leather. The edges are round (so folded IMO, not cut edges). But I can not see a seam.

I've been pondering this for a very long time. Can someone tell me how this can be done? I would be able to sleep better at night if I know.

Any opinions are very welcome!

Valete,
Falco

Re: Leather belt construction - LUCIUS ALFENUS AVITIANUS - 11-14-2008

Dear Marcus Mummius

I can help you to sleep tonight.... :lol:

See the second picture. In the background, unfocused, you can see the trick. There is only a very wide leather piece doubled and only a seam is there.

The stiches prevent the piece to fold free in an axial sense.

Re: Leather belt construction - LUCIUS ALFENUS AVITIANUS - 11-14-2008

An schematich section...

[Image: DIAGRAM.jpg]

Re: Leather belt construction - Marcus Mummius - 11-16-2008

Thanks Cesar. Your method is very nice, but wouldn't it result in one edge of the belt being much thicker than the other edge?
There are four layers of leather at the bottom edge and only two at the top so one edge is twice as thick.

Or perhaps the leather of the edges should be tinned out with a skive to make it thinner in that area?

Re: Leather belt construction - Gaius Julius Caesar - 11-16-2008

I have been pondering this for some time too! :?
Perhaps I can enlighten you soon! (or possibly not) :roll:

Re: Leather belt construction - brennivs - tony drake - 11-16-2008

Marcvs I would say it is like this Big Grin

This may be a bit trickey but if you wet the leather and clamp it down until dry then it should stay together when sewing Big Grin

If you look at the bottom edge of your pics the seam is just noticable as it is a different colour and not smooth looking Big Grin

You will have to have both edges butted up for a snug fit.
Regards Brennivs Big Grin

Re: Leather belt construction - Medicus matt - 11-17-2008

Tony's method is how I'd do it, skiving the overlapping edges to keep the overall thickness the same.

What I do find very odd is that the maker has gone to all that effort and has STILL rivetted all the way through both layers, rather than just through the outer to give a nice clean finish on the inside (see top picture). Odd.

I do like that copper plate with the interlace on it though...

Re: Leather belt construction - Gaius Julius Caesar - 11-17-2008

Apparently, the evidence points to this from what I have heard. I asked an experienced armourer about this a while ago!

Re: Leather belt construction - Medicus matt - 11-21-2008

Quote:Apparently, the evidence points to this from what I have heard. I asked an experienced armourer about this a while ago!

What, to the rivet going all the way through? I wonder what evidence that'd be then? Presumably it's just mineralised leather remnants showing on the rivet shanks.
Given the way that leather can delaminate I'd want to see a lot of examples where it looks like two seperate layers of leather on the shank before I'd be convinced that this was the case.

Re: Leather belt construction - Gaius Julius Caesar - 11-21-2008

Where is the evidence they used 2 layers?

It would also mean any repair would require opening up the double stitches to replace a rivet etc....

Re: Leather belt construction - Medicus matt - 11-21-2008

Quote:Where is the evidence they used 2 layers?

It would also mean any repair would require opening up the double stitches to replace a rivet etc....

I'm trying to imagine the circumstances under which you'd have to replace a rivet that wouldn't involve enough damage to the belt that you'd be wanting to replace the leather anyway.

Re: Leather belt construction - M. Demetrius - 11-21-2008

Sometimes a poorly peened rivet will just fall off. Putting it back on, in a two later belt with the rivet inside would indeed be an irritating task. It's enough trouble to put rivets on the first time!

Re: Leather belt construction - PhilusEstilius - 11-21-2008

I do begin to wonder just what happened as far as the Velsen belt, that is when the guy decided to upgrade the tinned plates with sheet silver. The exact same plates were used but would the guy who did the job make a new leather belt or just use the old one.

Re: Leather belt construction - jvrjenivs - 11-29-2008

Okay, next question I've for doing a belt like this, how would you do the narrower part (which goes through the buckle)? Just one layer (which wouldn't be stiff enough I guess. So 2 layers stitched together (it looks like Erik did this on the first picture (red belt)?

Re: Leather belt construction - M. Demetrius - 11-29-2008

Not to mention the frequently fancy-shaped ends that are sometimes seen. I can't see a way to fold the leathers under for something like that. Maybe that's why they often used metal terminals at the ends of belts: to cover the rough ends that occurred there.