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+--- Thread: Doping in Antiquity? (/showthread.php?tid=10141)
Doping in Antiquity? - Medusa Gladiatrix - 08-09-2007
I'm wondering with all these doping discussions going on lately if the sportsmen/-women of Antiquity also used doping. There are surely plants around which have one or the other effect which could benefit you for one or the other type of sports. For a Greek athlete it was important to win at the Games in contrary to the modern Olympic idea of participating is great, only winning counted back then. For a gladiator surely it would be benefiting as well if he was stronger than his oponent, or had more stamina etc.
So does anyone of you know if there was doping in antiquity? And if yes, what did they use?
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Aetius Helvius Merula - 08-09-2007
*two gladiators are sitting down, with glazed looks on their faces*
'Think it's gonna fall?'
'What?'
'The Empire.'
shrugs. 'F@*# it.'
Sorry, I couldn't resist :lol: I know that poppy juice was used like laudnadum was in the 19th century, as a general painkiller and cure-all. And I've also come across references to 'burning hemp seeds inside a small tent', though that was a Scythian thing, written by Greek writers.
It seems likely that some would use such things, to draw out the fights or games for the crowds' enjoyment. It also seems likely that purists would frown on it; like if you need dope, you can't be all that good. But I don't have any sources for that.
Besides, burning hemps seeds in a small room before the Games would just make the contestants really mellow, and munch on snacks
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - F. Antili Oregensis - 08-15-2007
Would charms also fall into this category?
Aries
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Medusa Gladiatrix - 08-15-2007
You are thinking about the defixiones written on lead tablets? This falls more into superstitions and I rather would like to discuss that if you want in a seperate thread. When posing the question about doping I was thinking more about substances which you eat/drink etc. to make you better in your sports whatever that is, e.g. Greek athlete or gladiator.
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Tarbicus - 08-15-2007
I'd have thought Pliny's Natural History would be a place to search through.
http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/R ... /home.html
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Medusa Gladiatrix - 08-15-2007
Salve Tarbice,
Thanks for the link but unfortunately it is not much of a help since the parts of Plinius' Natural History where he could have mentioned the effect of plants is not available in English translation only in Latin - and my Latin is not good enough to read a text like that
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Praefectusclassis - 08-15-2007
Hi Svenja,
Have you tried getting the Loeb volume with the right part of Pliny's NH?
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Medusa Gladiatrix - 08-15-2007
Hi Jasper,
I'm sure I could get a German print version of Plinius as well. But actually I had just posted this question hoping that someone might know something off hand, from ancient sources or also from modern scholars.
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - S AUFIDIUS - 08-15-2007
Try some sheep or bull testicles.....
http://stud-www.uni-marburg.de/~Loewer2/Doping.pdf
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - john m roberts - 08-15-2007
Didn't Nero quaff some concoction that included ashes of boar poop? It was supposed to make his charioteering better.
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - F. Antili Oregensis - 08-16-2007
Most of what the Gladiators used would probably have fallen under the category of superstitions by todays standards. However it is very difficult to discount the psychological impact they would have for individual Gladiators.
The other point not to overlook would be the insertion of drugs for opposing Gladiators to inhibit their abilities in the arena as well.
Aries
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - M. Demetrius - 08-16-2007
But Aries, weren't fights generally between gladiators of the same school? If so, it would complicate the matter of drugging opponents, since as I've read at least, a fighter might not know who he was fighting until the gates opened...and even then it might be hard to tell behind the helmet, eh?
I wouldn't mind giving my opponent some stupor-producer, though, after all, those blades were kinda sharp. I bleed easily when punctured, and don't like that one bit. :o lol:
Re: Doping in Antiquity? - Medusa Gladiatrix - 08-16-2007
Quote:But Aries, weren't fights generally between gladiators of the same school? If so, it would complicate the matter of drugging opponents, since as I've read at least, a fighter might not know who he was fighting until the gates opened...and even then it might be hard to tell behind the helmet, eh?
At large munera (mostly those held in Rome by the Emperor) there were gladiators from several schools fighting. Even in Rome alone were four ludi though one of them - the ludus matinus - was for the venatores not for the gladiators. At small events in the provinces though all gladiators came from one school very often of a ludus traveling through the provinces hence not a local ludus.
When an editor (organizer of the games) rented gladiators from a lanista he discussed with the lanista the pairings and the level of the gladiators. So a primus palus (highest level) murmillo was most likely to fight a primus palus thraex in order to have equal chances for both fighters and an interesting fight. When looking at the graffitis in Pompeii there was one occasion were a tiro gladiator won two fights against veterani. Some days before the munus the gladiators were presented on the forum and it was announced who their opponent was so people could bet on them. In Pompeii this program was written on the walls. So you knew who your opponent would be in your next fight.
doping elephants - kistlerj - 10-12-2007
I have not read through all the posts on this line, so perhaps it has come up before... but at least some of the animals used in combat were doped.
Elephants in particular had a long history of being drugged in some way before battle. Asians especially, were given great quantities of alcohol and some narcotics to calm or inspire them before battle, depending on which they needed. Just like humans, elephants react differently to drugs and alcohol, some becoming belligerent and others docile in reaction.
Whether the Romans did this in the gladiator games is uncertain, but they did hire or use captured professional elephant riders, who would have known these tricks, and so it is likely they were likewise doped. Pompey the Great would have been wise to do so before the debacle of his first gladiator contest, when the elephants panic and implored the crowd for help while being slaughtered. Pompey was berated by the angry crowd for his cruelty to the poor animals. Perhaps that was rightly deserved, but had the elephants been drugged they would not likely have panicked in that dramatic way.
John K