Anyone been watching The Face of Britain on Saturday nights?
http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi ... /face.html
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Face-Britain-Ge ... 0743295293
An archaeologist has joined in with Oxford to make a programme about DNA analysis of different regions in Britain to see what the predominant roots of the population are. So far, they've done the South West, East and North East.
Surprisingly, or perhaps not, the South West and the tip of South West Wales have turned out predominantly Celt, and the East and North East Anglo-Saxon. Sadly, there was a big disappointment for Northeasterners, as Danish Viking DNA is identical to Anglo-Saxon, but the whole Geordie way of speaking and place names points more to an Anglo-Saxon heritage. Facial features are also being analysed, and there are strong correlations between ancient facial reconstructions and modern features, even between the East and parts of Holland.
All very interesting anyway. I wonder how the North West will fair :?
I came across this company who will do a DNA trace for you for a fee, as well:
http://www.shop.oxfordancestors.com/
Hi,
I watched the episode last night, and it was a bit spooky when it showed the facial resemblances of people in East Anglia, and also those in Friesland.
I missed last week's episode, but it apparently showed that there are more Celtic Britons than was previously thought in England. Although what DNA do 'Celts' have ? I was under the impression that virtually all of Europe had 'Celtic' DNA.
I would have paid good money though for Neil Oliver to have been denounced as a full blooded Anglo Saxon :twisted:
Quote: So far, they've done the South West, East and North East.
Surprisingly, or perhaps not, the South West and the tip of South West Wales have turned out predominantly Celt, and the East and North East Anglo-Saxon.
South West - Celtic...yes and proud of that.....but arrrrggggghhhh - not Saxon please....
hock:
hock:
I don't mind the 'Anglo' half of my East Anglian ancestry !!!
Quote:I came across this company who will do a DNA trace for you for a fee, as well: http://www.shop.oxfordancestors.com/
For a moment there, I thought it said 'free'..oh well
I just read what Memmia said about the facial resemblances.....does anybody have a recording of these programmes.....???
I know I resemble a paternal g.g. grandmother from Oxfordshire, a reconstructed Celtic female warrior...and an older version of a female Greek friend...! I was watching a video earlier about the comparisons between early and modern Greek features....
Incidentially my dear, late father had the Seleucid nose...!!!
Quote:South West - Celtic...yes and proud of that.....but arrrrggggghhhh - not Saxon please....
I don't mind the 'Anglo' half of my East Anglian ancestry !!!
I don´t get it... Is there something wrong about having Saxon Ancestors?
It might have something to do with Arthur? :wink:
Quote:Hi,
Although what DNA do 'Celts' have ? I was under the impression that virtually all of Europe had 'Celtic' DNA.
Joanne, when in a British context people talk about "Celtic" DNA, it seems they refer to the genetic markers that are typical of say, the modern Welsh and the Irish. That does not mean that these also apply to continental Celts (unfortunately, it's hard to get good recent info about similar research in, say, central and southern Germany and France). Also, it's conceivable that the "Celts" (in the sense of pre-Roman, Celtic-speakers) in lowland Britain may have had a different genetic mix from those in Wales, possibly already more linked with continental populations.
It all depends on whether the arrival of the Celtic languages in Britain were accompanied by a significant influx of new people, and the degree in which they differed from the native population at that time.
Quote:It might have something to do with Arthur? :wink:
Hmmmh, yes it does have something to do with Arthur :wink:
I have never liked the Saxons and felt very ashamed of myself for liking Kai, the one in Arthur of the Britons.... :oops: I loved that series!!!!
I always seperate Saxons from Jutes and Angles..... and if somebody calls me a Sassanach... :x x roll:
Quote:Memmia:30q1mcav Wrote:Hi,
Although what DNA do 'Celts' have ? I was under the impression that virtually all of Europe had 'Celtic' DNA.
Joanne, when in a British context people talk about "Celtic" DNA, it seems they refer to the genetic markers that are typical of say, the modern Welsh and the Irish. That does not mean that these also apply to continental Celts (unfortunately, it's hard to get good recent info about similar research in, say, central and southern Germany and France). Also, it's conceivable that the "Celts" (in the sense of pre-Roman, Celtic-speakers) in lowland Britain may have had a different genetic mix from those in Wales, possibly already more linked with continental populations.
It all depends on whether the arrival of the Celtic languages in Britain were accompanied by a significant influx of new people, and the degree in which they differed from the native population at that time.
Hi Andreas,
I do remember about 3 years ago, it was revealed after scrupulous genetic testing that the Welsh, Irish and many Scots shared identical DNA with people in Northern Spain, such as the Basques. The DNA proved an age old theory (and legend) that the Irish, in particular those they called 'black Irish' are blood brothers to the Celtic Spanish. It was surprising though that the Welsh in particular shared the same DNA, as it was supposed that they had different ancestors seeing as the language is so different to Gaelic (q-Celts and p-Celts). A study a few years back on English people showed that they too had more Celtic ancestry than was previously thought, although it was supposed to be different to the Irish/ Scots/ Welsh. Sadly I never found out any more details, and I wish I had a source for this.
)
P.S. I found one link regarding the Basque connection
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/1256894.stm
Quote:the whole Geordie way of speaking and place names points more to an Anglo-Saxon heritage.
Did they actually suggest that on TV? Well, place names are one thing of course but the way of speaking? That's such a load of .. Well, let's put it this way: language is not connected to dna. Linguistics have their own rules. If the population is stable and relatively isolated you might expect that they speak as their ancestors did , but if not, anything goes. You can bring Chinese children to The Netherlands, and they will speak Dutch like any other child.
Quote:It was surprising though that the Welsh in particular shared the same DNA, as it was supposed that they had different ancestors seeing as the language is so different to Gaelic (q-Celts and p-Celts).
Same comment as above -ancestors may bring a new language but leave no mark on the population, or vice versa: they may change the dna of the population but fail to leave their language as the dominating one.
Are there any such research reports for France? One would expect 'Celtic' dna, but the language is developed from Latin.. Breton, of course, is a later import from Britain.
Quote:Well, place names are one thing of course but the way of speaking? That's such a load of .. Well, let's put it this way: language is not connected to dna.
Nor are place names, but it wasn't a case of using only one thing to put the probability higher, it was a combination of things (language which included actual Anglo-Saxon words not Viking + DNA + place names) all of which combined to indicate one predominant likelihood. Give them some credit, the programmes researchers didn't just make it up, but a leading expert in linguistics was consulted who himself combined the different types of evidence.
Quote:I do remember about 3 years ago, it was revealed after scrupulous genetic testing that the Welsh, Irish and many Scots shared identical DNA with people in Northern Spain, such as the Basques. The DNA proved an age old theory (and legend) that the Irish, in particular those they called 'black Irish' are blood brothers to the Celtic Spanish.
P.S. I found one link regarding the Basque connection
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/1256894.stm
Hmmh:
Along with my 'West Country' ancestry from my father, (and also on my mother's further back) I am a quarter Irish (Eire). My blood group is Rh 'O' Negative, which has it's highest concentration amongst the Basque...
However, the Irish is on my mother's side and this is not her blood group, so maybe my father's.
My father's surname is under the DNA group section for Iberian Celt/Scandanavian....
Quote:Memmia:e1pa5nka Wrote:I do remember about 3 years ago, it was revealed after scrupulous genetic testing that the Welsh, Irish and many Scots shared identical DNA with people in Northern Spain, such as the Basques. The DNA proved an age old theory (and legend) that the Irish, in particular those they called 'black Irish' are blood brothers to the Celtic Spanish.
P.S. I found one link regarding the Basque connection
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/1256894.stm
Hmmh:
Along with my 'West Country' ancestry from my father, (and also on my mother's further back) I am a quarter Irish (Eire). My blood group is Rh 'O' Negative, which has it's highest concentration amongst the Basque...
However, the Irish is on my mother's side and this is not her blood group, so maybe my father's.
My father's surname is under the DNA group section for Iberian Celt/Scandanavian....
I think my DNA would probably indicate my ancestors came from another planet. Especially my dad's side, they're all barking mad :?
I know one of my grandmothers is of Scottish and Irish descent. I would love to know more about my family though, I think some of them originally came from France judging by their names.
This old article seems to indicate the Book of Enoch was right.....
and men did originally come from another planet (along with Memmias paternal ancestors :lol: :lol: )......us women
were here first....
Women are from Earth :lol: :lol:
Quote:This old article seems to indicate the Book of Enoch was right.....
and men did originally come from another planet (along with Memmias paternal ancestors :lol: :lol: )......us women were here first....
Women are from Earth :lol: :lol:
:lol: :lol:
Either that or our maternal 'Eve' liked her toyboys to be very very very young, :wink:
Quote:Did they actually suggest that on TV? Well, place names are one thing of course but the way of speaking? That's such a load of .. Well, let's put it this way: language is not connected to dna. Linguistics have their own rules. If the population is stable and relatively isolated you might expect that they speak as their ancestors did , but if not, anything goes. You can bring Chinese children to The Netherlands, and they will speak Dutch like any other child.
Agreed "heritage" is not always DNA based but apparently old time Geordies could hold a conversation with Friesian fishing boat skippers. The linguist said that Friesian dialect is the closest we have to old Anglo Saxon (Anglo/Jute/Saxon?).
The evidence indicates a replacement of the "Celtic" population by (a) Angles etc then (b) Danish Vikings ....... :roll:
Now we just need to find some Sarmatian DNA & lingusitic imprint in the Cumbrian region :twisted: