RomanArmyTalk

We don't see many of the above, in England, despite the size of the black population. Are there any black re-enactors out there, perhaps doing Ancient Egypt? There should be Ethiopians and Sudanese. Libyans and Numidians?

There's a reference to Ethiopians dressing a beautiful maiden in Hoplite armour, including Corinthian helmet, somewhere (Xenophon?). It would be great to represent some of the great civilizations of Ancient Africa.

I have mentioned, elsewhere, the possibility of having Indian/Pakistani re-enactors in a Greek festival. Any takers?

Well I found this two People in my Osprey book's....

The Numidian, Berbers, Garamantes, Libyans etc., are the aboriginal people of North Africa, They can't be confuse with the True Black's, wich are:
Ethiopians, Sudaneses,Meriotics,Blemmye's, ancient Nubian's & Cusites or Cushites, etc.

The first group, were darkers by the sun, and they look like some Hispanic & Spanish people from Andalucia, wich many people of this two groups descended from them, but some are rufus like an ancient Liyan tribe. From a Berber tribe called Ifriki or Ifrikians, from them comefrom the generative name Africa to the hole continent, not from the black's, tha's a mistake....

By the way Black's first and then Arabs conqueror's mixed with some or many of the milenial aboriginal north africans, in earlyer times they were more pure in blood . But some tribe's still 100% pure blooded berber's...


But it would be cool! D ... and more!

If I'm not wrong, I heard once that after Crist die, in a time there was a hight ranging Roman officer, or Pretorian or something like that, Who was Black... that he got, or was the protector of the Spear that once pierced the body of Crist.... tha was interested ...

Well I just was thinking about that too few days ago hock: , there should be Black reenactors, because they contributed so much in ancient history...& Roma! :wink: ...

Also I saw once a statue of a Black- medieval Night (a African) some were ? maybe in a Castle, was very nice to see...




Numidian & Roman

From left to right: 1-Numidian prince, 2nd C. BC/ 2- Berber horseman, 1st C. BC/ 3- Garamante warrior, 1st C. BC

Left: 1- Meriotic Warrior, 1st C. AD/ 2- Sudanese tribal warrior, 2nd C. AD/ 3- Meriotic Lady, 1st C. AD

Left: 1-Blemmye Warrior, 4th C. AD/ 2- King Silko, 3rd C. AD/ 3- Roman frontier guard, 4th C. AD

Arabia Felix & Etiopia, 4th-6th Cs. AD: Left: 1- Etiopian govenor, 6th C. AD/ 2-Omani marine, 3rd-4th Cs. AD/ 3- Yemeni Soldier, 5th C. AD....

Quote:If I'm not wrong, I heard once that after Crist die, in a time there was a hight ranging Roman officer, or Pretorian or something like that, Who was Black... that he got, or was the protector of the Spear that once pierced the body of Crist.... tha was interested ...

That was Saint Morris, a Roman soldier from the early third century. He was supposed to have been martyred for refusing to take part of a massicre of Christians as he was a convert himself. He also was supposed to have carried the spear used to pierce Christ's side at the crucifixion.

Thanks for the responses, chaps. Great pictures, Gioi. Now all we need to do is find some black people who'd like to be re-enactors! I have friends in Sudan, but i doubt they'll be able to come.

Thanks Tiberius, for recall me that :wink:

Oh! I didn't know that I have this in my greek books! hock:


Here a real alabastron showing a marine Aetiopian dressed and equipped as Persians.



And here at lef shows an Aetiopian marine, also they fought as infantry - Herodotus (9.32)...

Quote:

Quote:If I'm not wrong, I heard once that after Crist die, in a time there was a hight ranging Roman officer, or Pretorian or something like that, Who was Black... that he got, or was the protector of the Spear that once pierced the body of Crist.... tha was interested ...

That was Saint Morris, a Roman soldier from the early third century. He was supposed to have been martyred for refusing to take part of a massicre of Christians as he was a convert himself. He also was supposed to have carried the spear used to pierce Christ's side at the crucifixion.

Actually it's written Maurice. Indeed he's rumopured to have been black.

Well, if St. Maurice lived, - black or not - he was one of us, a late Roman soldier! Yay!

But for those who want to know more about his story and the legend of the Theban legion, look here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theban_Legion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Maurice

and above all, for the studious among us, here:

http://www.ucc.ie/milmart/maurorig.html

Oh! Chariavolda, that the statue that I was talking about that I see some where....

So his gear it look too far from his time realy hock: ?

The Magdeburg statue is dressed in contemporary (13th century) knightly garb, as was customary in the High Middle Ages with figures and scenes from antiquity. I also seem to vaguely remember from an old documentary series the suggestion that Maurice's depiction as a "black" knight was inspired by contacts between the Crusader states and the Christian Nubian kingdoms in the Sudan during the 12th century.

It has been claimed -by Gedaliah Alon, if I remember correctly- that Lusius Quietus, the Moorish prince who was sent by Trajan to occupy Judaea in 117 and harshly suppressed Judaism, was dark-skinned. I think this is not really black but it strongly suggests that the color of skin did not really matter in the Roman empire.

There's an article on him in the Jewish Encyclopedia: [url:2u0dbajc]http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=8&letter=Q[/url]. The conflict itself is mentioned at [url:2u0dbajc]http://www.livius.org/ja-jn/jewish_wars/jwar06.html[/url]. His cavalry men are shown on Trajan's column (scenes 43-44)

Well Herodotus talks about Nubians and Ethiopians with leopard skins and a warband with horsekulls and half body painted white and the other half read.
Well they must have looked scary but they did not seem to have impressed the Spartans much at Thermopylae.
It makes though an interesting subject for black re-enactors I guess.
Kind regards
Stefanos

[b]Paul have you been lucky enough to find any black friend, to come to the festival?

I find this pics of two blacks in greek costume, then I try to do a sketch of one of them.

New Scientist has an article about some surprising results from reconstructions of the Fayum mummies, especially when compared to their portraits: Image is Everything
[quote]But, more than a century after they came to light, nobody had tested the accuracy of the Fayum portraitsâ€â€

I always find it strange that darker skinned people do not seem to be so interested in portraying their ancestral heritage as some others.
There are a few around in the later periods, Viking and Medieval warriors.
The Jerash Romans/gladiators are locals and I think there are other groups around in the Middle East. It would be great to see some Egyptians marching around...
Maybe its something to do with caucasian bloodlines, that we feel the need to recreate the past more..Greeks/Macedonian, Roman, Celtics,
Germanics and their allies/enemies seem to predominate from our time period.
regards
Arthes

I think it is a cultural thing. re-enactment started out (I think) in the UK, then got big in the US and continental Europe. But while even here in The Netherlands it's not widely known (even if we have been at it for years and years), I heard in Italy it's even newer.
So maybe

a) It's not even widely known in Europe/USA
b) If known at all in other countires, it's percieved as something typically western?