RomanArmyTalk

I just received a bear pelt and I'm pondering how to mount it on my Gallic G helmet. The head fur is complete, suggesting that I need to make a cut along the bottom to the lower lip. I'm thinking that a couple of leather straps stitched inside tied to rings located both in the front and back of the helmet might serve to keep the pelt in place. How of others done this? <p></p><i></i>

My bearskin is sometimes attached to a Coolus "E". Since we do auxiliaries I fold the "face" back underneath, and attach the skin to the helmet with leather thongs. If I loan the hide to the legion they also get the bear skull, and can attach it all with leather thongs. I currently am trying to use marbles for the eyes, but I should go ahead and get some better glass eyes. <p></p><i></i>

A local taxidermist sold me a pair of glass eyes. I installed them by placing a leather patch behind each eye opening secured via a few tunnel stitches. A little super glue then secured each eye. <p></p><i></i>

Salvete,

Like the original, now anonymous poster I was wondering how best to mount a bearskin on a helmet. The bearskin I will have skin is just a tanned skin, with the face intact. It will be used for a legionary unit.

I don't really like the plastic heads most groups have inside their animal pelts. Going from the depections in sculptural art, and the insights of some people here on RAT I think just a pelt would be more authentic.

Should I try to form the head over the helmet a bit? I was told that wetting the head with a salt water solution for an hour would make it easily mouldable...

How best to attach the pelt to a helmet? I'm thinking of stiching in some folded leather pieces through which I can run a leather lace. How much attachment points should I have? With a gallic helmet I could attach it to the crest attachment rings at the back an front of the skull. But what about a coolus? The crest spike might be a problem. But I could perhaps attach the skin at the sides to the side plume holders...
I haven't got an idea how to attach it to the Levy Face mask helmet I have... This helmet doesn't seem to have any obvious attachment points on the bowl...

Vale,
Jef

Quote:Since we do auxiliaries I fold the "face" back underneath

Why on earth would you want to do that? :?

Have a look at all the images from Trajan's Column where auxiliary standard bearers are depicted, and you will see that they all have faces on the pelts. (Even the Lions).

Trajan addressing his auxiliaries..




Bearded auxiliary signifers wearing lion pelts..

Also the tombstone of a signifer from Coh V Astvrvm..
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/component/ ... Itemid,94/

All of these auxiliary soldiers are wearing skins with intact faces.

Ah, sorry, Peroni but I would have to disagree with you......the standard bearers you have depicted from Trajan's column are clearly Praetorians ( or at least display all the hallmarks), or else adlocutios, where all the standards surround the Emperor, so they cannot be identified with auxilia units....

AFIK, Lionskins were the preserve of Praetorians, bearskins with full masks the Legions, and all known Auxiliary signifers have the face cut away....as is clearly shown on the tombstone you refer to.

The subject of signifers, standards and their insignia is of course far from certain, but the above conventions seem to certainly apply in the Principate period.....

P.S. whence came those rather nice Column photos?

On my Gallc G helmet:


I used a few tunnel stitches to mount a leather strap to the bear that is in turn tied to the pair of rings on the helmet:



The false teeth on mounted on a wooden block.

Good looking teeth. What did you mount the wood block to the skin with, more stitching?

Quote:What did you mount the wood block to the skin with, more stitching?

The wooden block in simply glued in place with a pad of velcro keeping holding the teeth in place.

Quote:so they cannot be identified with auxilia units....

They are depicted in the same type of mail shirts and femenalia as the other auxiliaries on the Column. All legionaries have no leggings. AFAIK the only soldiers shown with beards on the Column are auxiliaries. Beards didn't become fashionable in the military until later on in the second century.

The Adlocutio is also shown on other scenes where the soldiers are clearly wearing segmented armour (legionaries(?))


If any of the soldiers are praetorians it's these guys here.. (note the auxiliary cavalryman (equites singulari perhaps) in the foreground. He is dressed completely different from the other soldiers. Just like the auxiliaries in my earlier post.


The scene in my first post shows all the soldiers as auxiliaries. What signs of 'praetorianism' do they 'clearly' show? I see no crests anywhere that are shown on legionaries or Praetorians in other scenes. And why are they all carrying a flat oval clipeus? :wink: Also none of the shield designs feature symbols typical of the Praetorian guard.

Well, Peroni, I did say that the subject was 'far from certain', but I still stick by what I said in my post as being most likely.

We are going off-topic into what is a complex subject, and it will be necessary to marshall bits of sometimes obscure evidence, but I would be delighted to pursue a discussion of the subject....perhaps we should move this to another thread.

Quote:They are depicted in the same type of mail shirts and femenalia as the other auxiliaries on the Column. All legionaries have no leggings.

Have you looked at the opening scenes on the column? ( showing the army,Praetorians and legionaries, crossing the bridge of boats and past Trajan on a dais, in review) They are led by standard bearers also shown in 'femenalia' and mail, though the troops are in segmentata and without breeches. If you apply the criteria that femenalia = auxilia ( which Adamklissi demonstrates is false) then there isn't a single Praetorian or legionary standard-bearer shown on the column, and the auxilia carried Eagles !

Your first image (in my view, and others) shows a legionary aquilifer and legionary vexillation standards ( or just possibly cohort ones), and your second image shows an aquilifer with three Praetorian Cohort standards behind...raising the possibility that although not 'brigaded' as a legion, the Praetorian cohorts in the field may have carried the Eagle.

I don't believe you can say that the shield designs are not Praetorian either.......

Could you PLEASE let me know the source of your column images......

Thanks Lee, that's very helpful!

How did you get the ears of the bear to stand up nicely?

Vale,
Jef

Quote:How did you get the ears of the bear to stand up nicely?

I did nothing to the ears. That's the way the pelt came.

Soak the bear's ears in water, then hold them in place with paper wads or other porous, sort of rigid material until the water is gone. They should stay in the shape you dried them (until they get soaked again, of course). The softening process during tanning rarely gets applied to the ears.

(Somehow I knew learning to make Mountain Man fur hats would be useful in Roman reenacting. :wink: )