RomanArmyTalk

Who are these troops on the left in this scene from Trajan's column (36) and what did the Romans call this shield with a clear double grip?

To me they look like Germanic auxilia not officially in Roman service...

Interesting grip !!!!!!!! as well as your pic of the Greek shield which i dont find strange at all

M.VIB.M.

I'm not so sure about the type of shield but if we look at the full picture of the man holding it, he does look very much like what we find of slingers or stone throwers from the sash that is going around his middle and over the left shoulder.

Quote:Who are these troops on the left in this scene from Trajan's column (36) ...

Aren't these the enigmatic clubmen?

I would've said that the main full-frontal figure (behind Trajan) has a Moorish hair style, but the man whom you've cut off at bottom left may have a Germanic hair style (hint of a Suebic knot? I'm looking at a low-res image) and appears to be carrying a club.

Quote:I would've said that the main full-frontal figure (behind Trajan) has a Moorish hair style, but the man whom you've cut off at bottom left may have a Germanic hair style (hint of a Suebic knot? I'm looking at a low-res image) and appears to be carrying a club.

The guy on the top left has a bit of "Princess Leia" hair too. I thought there might be a specific designation for the shield, or that the shields seen might just be artistic license.

Quote:I'm not so sure about the type of shield but if we look at the full picture of the man holding it, he does look very much like what we find of slingers or stone throwers from the sash that is going around his middle and over the left shoulder.

Not really a sash, just the 'off-the-shoulder' exomis/tunic depicted. The 'stonethrowers' use a fold of their cloak to hold a supply of stones.....

D. Campbell wrote:

Quote:Aren't these the enigmatic clubmen?

I would've said that the main full-frontal figure (behind Trajan) has a Moorish hair style, but the man whom you've cut off at bottom left may have a Germanic hair style (hint of a Suebic knot? I'm looking at a low-res image) and appears to be carrying a club.

Indeed they are. The partial figure cut off on the left carries a club ( the weapons of the others are not visible, being behind foreground figures, but may also be clubs). The main bearded figure with 'exomis', the figure to his left with the club( cut off here) and the two figures above them, as well as the two figures next to the tree all have clearly depicted 'suebic knots'. The remaining figure ( above the bearded man in 'exomis') may have a suebic knot, but his hair appears to be in 'corn rows' rather than the 'dreadlock' style depicted on Moors.

Behind these come a unit of auxiliaries, all depicted in 'bearskins/wolfskins over their helmets, and quite possibly intended to represent Batavians, who are known from archaeological examples to cover their helmets with animal pelts/masks.....

Quote:Behind these come a unit of auxiliaries, all depicted in 'bearskins/wolfskins over their helmets, and quite possibly intended to represent Batavians, who are known from archaeological examples to cover their helmets with animal pelts/masks.....

I don't think this is specifically a Batavian thing, but just a Germanic thing, as burials have been found in Scandinavia which also show that wolfskins were worn over the head by warriors.

The question was in two parts:

1. Who are these troops on the left in this scene (36) from Trajan's Column?
The scene posted by PMBardunias above is not the only one on Trajan's Column showing these warriors and their shields (see below). In scene 24 (Cichorius Plate XIX), the most prominent figure attacking Dacians is stripped to the waist, wearing baggy trousers and shoes, hair well-kempt, wielding a club in his right hand and the shield with brace and hand grip is clearly shown in his left. In scene 38 (Cichorius Plate XXIX) men similarly armed and dressed have more of an unkempt look, notably longer hair and shaggy beards resembling the individuals in scene 36 (Cichorius Plate XXVI) accompanying Emperor Trajan. In scene 70 (Cichorius Plate L) the men are shown in a shield wall formation viewed from the front at an angle, displaying their similar shield emblems which all surround a raised central boss.
In 'Ancient Germanic Warriors: Warrior Styles from Trajan's Column to Icelandic Sagas' (London: Routledge, 2004) Michael P. Speidel describes these men as "Germanic club-wielders" (pp88-93) as distinct from barefoot "berserker swordsmen" (pp60-66), which concurs with Duncan B. Campbell's assessment elsewhere on the board. I don't think there is enough information in the Column scenes for us to determine the nationalities of the club-wielders.

2. What did the Romans call this shield with a clear double grip?
Speidel does not give a Roman or Germanic name for the shield with the brace and hand grip. He devotes an entire chapter to shield walls or castles (pp103-109), and he discusses the shape and use of clubs in detail (p88); but does not notice the unusual design of the interior shield construction. My guess is, as is the case with other ancient arms and armour, there was no special - that is to say technical - name for it in ancient times.

Am I mistaken in seeing that a couple of these figures - the individuals actually holding clubs in Plate XIX and XXVII - also have swords or daggers hanging from their waists, the former on the left side and the latter on the right? If so, that's an interesting combination of club and sword.

In 'Ancient Germanic Warriors: Warrior Styles from Trajan's Column to Icelandic Sagas' (London: Routledge, 2004) Michael P. Speidel notes "scenes 24 and 36 of the Column show swords as the fall-back weapon of the club-men" (p90) and "bare-chested, Germanic warriors did indeed use curved swords" (ibid).

Lindsay Powell wrote:

Quote:"bare-chested, Germanic warriors did indeed use curved swords" (ibid).

Presumably that is a reference to the 'falx' ( or just possibly) 'sica' wielding warriors on the Adamklissi monument. The ones wielding the two-handed 'falx' can be identified as 'Bastarnae' tribesmen, and whether they were 'germanic' or celtic', or as I believe, both intermixed with the Geto-dacian natives is problematic. The 'sica' wielding warriors are normally ( from their dress etc) considered Dacian.

The 'allies' shown on the column appear to have straight swords, where these are visible.

In 'Ancient Germanic Warriors: Warrior Styles from Trajan's Column to Icelandic Sagas' (London: Routledge, 2004) Michael P. Speidel writes about Germanic warcraft, not Dacian. Neither the falx nor sica are listed in the index. For evidence of Germanic warriors using curved swords or cleavers he cites, for example:
1. Coin of the Hermunduri in Bavaria from C1st CE (p166);
2. Wooden dirk or sword found at Oberaden camp (p166);
3. Gravestone of Andes, Mainz (fig. 18.1, p167);
4. Sarcophagus from Portonaccio, Rome (fig. 18.2, p168);
5. Miniature bronze weapon from Enns, Oberoesterreich (fig. 18.3, p169);
6. Grave finds from Kaloz near Intercisa (Pannonia), Hungary (fig. 18.4, p170).

OK...so not the usual reference to 'Bastarnae' then?? ! :wink:

I thought it might be, because Speidel wrote that 'fantasy' book about berserkers - describing these semi-naked warriors under discussion here on Trajan's column as such..... hock: hock: