Ave,
The Romans are always portrayed as having red "uniforms" but was this actually the case. I beleive so for officers etc but what about the legionaires. Did they even have a standard "uniform"?
I have seen them portrayed in black in a few films etc, why so?
Also why (and if) did they wear red? i know the Spartans did so the enemy wouldn't see they where bleeding etc.
Cheers for any info
haggis
There are people of the site that know more about clothing than I do and I'm sure we have lots of threads on the subject,but first white/ off white seems to be as if not more common than more expensive red.
The Roman Army(thats a long period of time,and a lot of people)didn't have a uniform as we understand the word today.
Be very careful when it comes to films as they tend to be more to do with the likes/dislikes or image of the director than reality.
Having said that I've seen pics of what looks now like a linen black tunic from the Bolton museum collection but I doubt it was common,other colours were also used as I'm sure you would find on a search for tunics. :wink:
I have read several text books that describe the wearing of white during the later part of the Empire----Maybe the red hides the blood better so as not to discourage the troops during the fighting even though they were well trained. Perhaps red dye was easier to use.
Dante
Oh, young Jedi.... We have been over this topic MANY times, at great length. Do some searching or browsing.
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These are just a few. (Actually, just going to the member list and finding "WoadWarrior" brings up all KINDS of great stuff!)
That get you started? Vale,
Matthew
Greetings!
Look at this link:
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It has within it links to further discussions and the Great Tunic Debate.
Additionally it will reference member Graham Sumner's excellent series of books Roman Military Clothing (vol. 1-3).
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/184176 ... m%20Sumner
If you do not already own copies of these books you should consider adding them to your collection. These are essential texts to the study of Romany Military dress and should answer many (if not most) of your questions.
:wink:
Narukami
Quote:Oh, young Jedi.... (Actually, just going to the member list and finding "WoadWarrior" brings up all KINDS of great stuff!)
Matthew
Quite right Matthew!
I had forgotten his name but his questions did engender a lot of discussions both useful and frustrating.
:wink:
Narukami
Cheers!
Apologise for not doing a search. I tend to only look at the most recent topics.
Thanks very much for the links!
No prob, happy to help! Just keep on reading. And reading and reading and reading....
Wasn't Woady great? Several RAT members suffered brain hemorrhages while he was among us. I miss him!
Matthew
what about armour? was it a case of what ever they had or was it regimented? i'm more interested in when they 'switched' from chain mail to arrgh, the name fails me!) metal plates?
cheers
Quote:what about armour? was it a case of what ever they had or was it regimented? i'm more interested in when they 'switched' from chain mail to arrgh, the name fails me!) metal plates?
cheers
fhaggis there are no 'chains' in mail :wink:
The word you are looking for is Segmentata. Which with a search you will finds lots of interesting stuff.
Quote: Wasn't Woady great? Several RAT members suffered brain hemorrhages while he was among us. I miss him!
Matthew
Indeed so!
He did keep the conversations lively. Perhaps he is lurking here in the Forum or will return one day to plague, entertain and challenge us with his game of 20 questions.
:wink:
Narukami
Quote:what about armour? was it a case of what ever they had or was it regimented? i'm more interested in when they 'switched' from chain mail to arrgh, the name fails me!) metal plates?
cheers
Well, back in the Republic (say, through the 2nd century BC) each man was required to equip himself according to his wealth, and could be picked for service on an annual basis. Any man worth 10,000 drachmas or more had to have a shirt of mail, while those less wealthy wore only a small bronze pectoral plate. Any citizen who owned no property was generally not liable for army service. But by the first century AD the whole system had changed to volunteer service (mostly!), and any free-born citizen could join the legions while non-citizens mostly joined the auxiliaries. They were all paid, of course, and the cost of their equipment was deducted in installments from their pay. But strictly speaking they were still required to equip themselves. We know a lot of gear is being made by the army or by local contractors, so we assume that a recruit is issued kit upon enlistment, but we really don't know much about personal choice, etc.
We also don't know how much "issued" gear was dictated by law or regulations, and how much was just following fashion or style. It's amazing to see page after page of surviving helmets or belt plates, all subtly different yet all generally the same! There was clearly some personal choice involved, but generally sticking to established fashions. And we really don't find much "improvised" or "whatever" equipment of any sort, except for a few repairs (while other repairs are very involved or substantial). These guys were remarkably well-equipped overall.
The lorica segmentata appears in the late first century BC, but does not replace mail! Mail continues in use by many legionaries right alongside segmentata, and seems to be the more common armor among auxiliaries. When the segmentata disappears around 300 AD, mail is still the primary form of armor, and continues right through the middle ages. We have a few huge threads about all that, too!
Books, man, books! Peter Connolly, Graham Sumner, Mike Bishop, and so on. Here:
http://www.larp.com/legioxx/bibliog.html
Vale,
Matthew
Ah, the Tunic Wars...you gotta love it :wink:
Francis. I think it's good to resurrect old discussions now and then infact I would have thought that John who comes from Eboracum might have been familiar with the story of the guys who spent the night in that cellar in the City and found that possibly the VI Victrics wore Green.
If I only had a pound for every person who told me about Roman Ghost stories :roll: