RomanArmyTalk

http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php? ... &album=222

A lot of these look familiar, but I was a bit taken aback by these two:

http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php? ... i&img=4979

http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php? ... i&img=4968

The first one is very unusual, and unlike any helmet I've seen before. The workmanship looks pretty crude, and it has the vaguely Hellenistic brow band, but the rest of it is very strange.

The second looks very interesting. Where was it found? Are the green portions restored, or simply corroded bronze?

You always post very interesting images of artefacts from Bulgaria. Thanks again for sharing!

http://forum.boinaslava.net/showthread.php?t=9369
beotian helmet

Quote:http://forum.boinaslava.net/showthread.php?t=9369
beotian helmet

http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php? ... c=8277&hl=

Look like a good start for the Greek Helmet Database project!


http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php? ... c=8277&hl=

I never really had a problem with this before, but looking at this one, I am wondering which way is the front, and which way the back...... :? oops: :roll:

I wouldn't mind a copy of this one.

I'm intrigued by the two Hellenistic models with the horns. Are such found outside Bulgaria/Thrace or is it a local variant? Is there a cult association? To what animal do these horns belong? It looks like some sort of goat horn to me, but so thin they're almost like antennae.

Quote:

gladiator:27eq1fhh Wrote:http://forum.boinaslava.net/showthread.php?t=9369
beotian helmet

http://www.tforum.info/forum/index.php? ... c=8277&hl=

It seems pretty clear that in that first image the visor on the left side projects out further than that on the right, so that is the front. In addition, the "spikes" in the rims of such early Hellenistic Boeotian helmets always seem to point toward the front, so it can be said that the left side is the front with some certainty.

Quote:I'm intrigued by the two Hellenistic models with the horns. Are such found outside Bulgaria/Thrace or is it a local variant? Is there a cult association? To what animal do these horns belong? It looks like some sort of goat horn to me, but so thin they're almost like antennae.

It's a local variant. Unfortunately, I can't answer your other questions, but Chris Webber, who sometimes posts here, probably can.

The beotian helmet is unique both for Bulgaria and for Ancient warfare. When the helmet was send to me for exploration, its neckgard make me think that it was an addition. Latter I see on different auctions helmets from Pylos tipe with similar parts for protection that no doubt show that this helmet is original. I don’t think that this helmet is locally made. It is a Macedonian import remains from a march to the north.
About the helmet with the horns, I can not say when these are added. The same helmet but without horns is in Connolly. I have publications about helmets from Corinthian, Thracian, Beotian and Pylos type from Bulgaria, but on my own language. The summaries are usually very short and uninformative.

Quote:The beotian helmet is unique both for Bulgaria and for Ancient warfare. When the helmet was send to me for exploration, its neckgard make me think that it was an addition. Latter I see on different auctions helmets from Pylos tipe with similar parts for protection that no doubt show that this helmet is original. I don’t think that this helmet is locally made. It is a Macedonian import remains from a march to the north.

So how does that neckguard attach to the helmet itself? Is it inside, under the back rim? Also, could you comment on how much the helmet has been restored?

When I saw it, I was immediately reminded of this picture that I found some time ago on the internet. Is this just a different picture of the same helmet?

http://antiquemilitaryhistory.com/image ... helmet.jpg

I can't be the same. It lacks the holes in the back. The holes are another indication of what the front is. I wonder,did the holes had to do with the attachment of the neck guard? If there was a neckguard atacched in the inside of the "rim",then the lining that those holes secured would be purposeless I think...
Khairete
Giannis

I think, that in the holes in the back part of the helmet (48 in number) was attached the lining or the neckgard. I’m sure that the helmet was imported not made locally in Thrace like the other found here types – Corinthian, halkidian and Thracian

Are there any specimens of that Hellenistic helmet (with or without horns) that have survived with their cheekplates and neckguard intact? Connoly reproduces them in his painting of the Hydaspes battle, but I don't know if his reconstruction is based on specimens or is speculative. I've always liked that design, though it's a rare one. To me, it somehow looks very soldierly.

I have seen examples in commercial sires auctioning items from the Axel Gutman collection.

Kind regards