That's the question, isn't it? Why just we all know the equipment of those late legionaries, of the Marius' Reforms or the Imperial Praetorians. Don't you want to describe and reenact the old soldiers, the old hastati, principes and triarii, that conquered Italy, destroyed Carthage, colonized Spain... I always wanted to know how is the equipment of an old triarii. I never went to Rome, but I still now something about it by books or PC games like Rome: Total War. If someone of you brothers that know something about the equipment of these soldiers, just answer my message. Thanks.
And so, Romans, Strength and Honor, to you all!
Get yourself some nice books, like M.C. Bishop & J.C.N. Coulston, Roman Military Equipment. That will answer your question.
And there are several people doing early roman re-enactment, there are only more doing later periods, mostly because we know much more about the first centuries AD.
You need to put your real name in your signature - forum rule.
To add to the book list, Weapons of the Romans by Michel Feugere is a good one to read.
The hastati? Who knows? ....and from hereon in I got my hastatus mixed up with my triarius.....
I'm putting together a Republican impression, and the choice of what to make it look like is pretty big.
Which early roman legionary do you mean????? A Triarius, a Princeps or Hastatus or a Veles?????? Or all together????? The early republican army existed of three classes. The Veles represent the poorest people, with no body-armour, a fur hat or maybe a cheap helmet, a simple sword, a round shield and some light javelins. They were used in the role as skirmishers before the the battle-line. The Hastatus and/or Princeps represents the middle-class, with a pectorale (breast-shield) as body-armour, a helmet, sword, a light and a heavy Pilum (throwing spear), the large, oval scutum (shield) and maybe one greave on the leading left leg. They are the line-infantry. The Triarii represents the richest class, with the very expensive chain-mail, sword, helmet, a hasta (spear stabbing and throwing), maybe greaves on each leg and the same large, oval scutum as the Hastati/Princeps. They are the veterans of the roman army and the last line of defense in the battle.
Marcus, are you sure we can be so absolutely black and white about the poorer/richer divisions between hastati and triarii? Age must have had a factor in it, now we know an old ship was jokingly named Triarius, because of its age and clapped out condition, and it always fell back behind the fleet. At the other end of the scale, the velites were young and fleet of foot.
I'm also not certain how you can be so prescriptive about the armour for each type, and you left out the Princeps.
Alright
Now you all shut up
thanks for your answers
but I'm not sure of it... I know all that of the hastati, principes or triarii, and all its features. what I want to know is why we just care for the other modern legionaries? strange, isn't it? and it is the part of the roman history that I mostly prefer! the roman republic. you know the Punic wars, the conquering of Greece and the invasion of the Gauls... Hannibal, Scipio Africans, caius and tiberius Gracchus, and all those that fought for the same eagle, that one of the SPQR: Senatus Popolusque Romanus! Don't you guys love it?
He does mention them, but I was under the impression that the Princeps were more often depicted as armoured in mail too.
They were the more seasoned men in the prime of their life.
The hastati were the first to engage, then the princepi, then if that was not the end of the matter, the lines with drew through the triarii, who would perform a blocking action to allow the first for mations to regroup or with draw, what ever the decision was to be.
Hence the term 'when if falls to the triarii' or something like that.
There are actually several groups doing or forming earlier period sections,
which is all very exciting.
As Tarbicus says, if you put the info in your signature and on the side panel in your profile, it will be easier for the appropriate people to give you info on people in your area maybe, who are doing this period.
EDIT: Also you will see the answer to your question as to why people do later periods at the moment in one of the posts above.
@ Jim.
Yes, i agree, i forgot the age
D
Quote:He does mention them, but I was under the impression that the Princeps were more often depicted as armoured in mail too.
Sorry, should have phrased it as describing the princeps.
I've seen them depicted in mail, pectorals, musculata, tunics only, blah blah blah. Given the timespan we're talking about I don't even see why we feel the need to say "It was so."
As for strict formations, Lendon has a lot to say about that.
Quote:Araujo said: Alright Now you all shut up
hock:
Yes Jim, i explained it to easy. Next time, first i think, than i write.
MODERATING: Araujo, Please put your real name into your signature, before making new posts. You can do this by altering your profile. This is a rule on this forum. Also, please read the forum rules before making any new posts. The comment quoted by Mark above is way out of line. I suppose this is due to a language difficulty, but since we don´t know where you are from this is hard to say. As such it is unacceptable.
Marcus Ahenobarbus, please stop using those vast amounts of "?" and "!" in every other post. Usually this is regarded as "screaming" on the internet, and conveys a bad tone, which you, I am quite sure, do not intend.
Okay, no problem. I don´t know that.
I think the principes wore the same mail armour like the hastati. They were older, and that was definitly the only difference. They charged after the hastati, and only if the enemy would still be in camp. They were divided into 15 manipuli, the roman tactic, and they were... maybe 22 years old.
There were the triarii, finally. Those ones were the most experienced soldiers, and they had to be more than 22, I think. And probably they were only reelected soldiers, after their 10 years' military service. They almost didn't fight, because they were the last ones to do that.
And I've got to say that the velites were inicially divided into three different groups: the leves (the most simple skirmishers), the acceni (slingers of Rome) and the rorarii (better trained and reserve skirmishers). They were poor, but the Rorarii were like a Town Garrison. They had a proper shield and formed an important part of the roman legion.
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Quote:but the Rorarii were like a Town Garrison. They had a proper shield and formed an important part of the roman legion.
Before the standing army, the whole Roman army seems to have been a citizen militia. Fight in the campaign season, go home for the rest of the year, with a few notable exceptions.
There is also a theory the rorarii were at the back of the army as a reserve with the accensi, filling in for casualties in the battle or campaign. Not actually part of the line, though. Later on they seem to have been merged into the velites.
http://www.roman-empire.net/army/army.html
Rigidly defining the Republican army is like saying James Bond drives an Aston Martin DB5.