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Had anyone noticed this?

Axes, bones, jewellery and 60 pairs of shoes - secrets of Roman fort revealed
30 September 2011

http://news.scotsman.com/dundee/Axes-bon...6845124.jp
Quote:Had anyone noticed this?

Axes, bones, jewellery and 60 pairs of shoes - secrets of Roman fort revealed
30 September 2011

Yes, but sincerely doubt the 'pairs' bit as Roman footwear is usually thrown away singly (certainly none of the boots from my well at Inveresk matched). I seem to recall Carol van Driel-Murray telling me many years ago that, statistically, the Romans had more left feet than right!

Mike Bishop
Quote:Camelon has long been suggested as the possible site for Camelot, the home of King Arthur... The idea of King Arthur as a Roman was the basis of the 2004 Hollywood movie, King Arthur, starring Clive Owen, as a Roman centurion.
Is it obligatory for news reports on Roman finds to always mention daft Hollywood movies?

Interesting, anyway, even if the area is a bit spoilt for Roman remains already! Is the idea that this fort (or forts) predated the Antonine wall? It seems rather closely placed to the north of it. A lengthy spell of occupation might fit with the Gask Ridge and other northern fortifications of the Flavian era.
Quote:Is it obligatory for news reports on Roman finds to always mention daft Hollywood movies?

It appeals to the lowest common denominator and, I suspect, also helps the story get more Google hit results.

The archeologist says they have only excavated 10% of the site, and the story states a Tesco is going up there. I hope they have time to properly finish the process before the construction begins.
Quote:
Quote:Camelon has long been suggested as the possible site for Camelot
Albeit mainly by people who confuse 't' with 'n', journos for instance...

Quote:Is it obligatory for news reports on Roman finds to always mention daft Hollywood movies?
Absolutely!

Quote:Interesting, anyway, even if the area is a bit spoilt for Roman remains already! Is the idea that this fort (or forts) predated the Antonine wall? It seems rather closely placed to the north of it. A lengthy spell of occupation might fit with the Gask Ridge and other northern fortifications of the Flavian era.
Camelon has long been known as a Flavian site. Val Maxfield has dug there and I think (I don't have an Obmann to hand, so this is off the top of my head) is the most northerly find for a decorated piece of dagger (or scabbard). Since it sits slightly to the north of the Wall (clever how they anticipated the siting of the Tesco, there) it would be a bit odd if it were part of it. I have a distinct memory of most of it lying under a golf course (golf, in Falkirk! Do they play it with hand-grenades?!). Duncan will be able to come out with more facty chunks than I...

Mike Bishop
Quote:Duncan will be able to come out with more facty chunks than I...
Ah, the state of contemporary academia eh - historical analysis replaced by 'facty chunks' :lol:
Quote:Ah, the state of contemporary academia eh - historical analysis replaced by 'facty chunks' :lol:
Institutional academics aren't even allowed that these days. They have to supply at least three appearances a month in a cheesy documentary and a centrefold for History Today wearing nothing but a lorica posingpouchiana... O tempora, O mores!

Mike Bishop
Have you been on the red wine Mr Bishop? Smile
Quote:Have you been on the red wine Mr Bishop? Smile
Strictly a cider man myself unless forced to slum it and imbibe the juice of the grape!

Mike Bishop
"I don't have an Obmann to hand"

Luckily in that case, I do have Obmann to hand (Obmann 2000 at any rate - not aware of anything else he has published on the matter since then) and the most northerly dagger element he mentions is the Corbridge sheath fragment, which he lists as 'GB12'. He is only dealing with first century AD daggers of course. The only other dagger elements I was aware of from further north were the Antonine period grip plate from Bar Hill and dagger from Inveresk (which I don't have a picture of unfortunately).


"Strictly a cider man myself"

Really? :wink:
Careful though Dr Bishop, lest well meaning souls misinterpret your statement and start sending you complimentary bottles of Strongbow, Woodpecker or Blackthorn. :wink:

Crispvs
Ows about a bit a Scrumpy Jack to wets yer whistle, Mr Bishop, sir?? :wink:
Quote:Duncan will be able to come out with more facty chunks than I...
Just noticed this thread. So here, for what they are worth, are some facty chunks.

Camelon is a bit of a mess, I'm afraid. Not the most fortunate of Roman sites. It was subjected to full-scale excavation in 1899-1900, when excavation techniques were ... how to phrase this politely ... rather less sophisticated than nowadays. The fort presented the peculiar spectacle of a north area and a south area (ramparts still standing in the 18th C), of which the south area was threatened by factory development, so ... the excavators chose to concentrate on the north bit. :roll:

The 1899-1900 excavations proved Antonine occupation, as an outlier of the Antonine Wall. In fact, there may well have been a port, if the River Carron had been navigable (as seems likely). Anyhow, this slide (below) from my Flavian Scotland lecture shows (left) the enormously complex conglomeration of sites in the area, and (right) the site as it appeared in the 18th C. (Hopefully, I haven't breached any copyright laws by posting it here.)
[attachment=1879]Camelon-2.jpg[/attachment]
It's in my Flavian Scotland lecture because excavations in 1970s confirmed that a Flavian fort (perhaps two phases) lay underneath the Antonine one. Some of the temporary camps clustered around will be Flavian, too (Flavian pottery from at least one, iirc).

It's still a bit of a mess. :?
Quote:Careful though Dr Bishop, lest well meaning souls misinterpret your statement and start sending you complimentary bottles of Strongbow, Woodpecker or Blackthorn. :wink:Crispvs
THOSE aren't cider, this is! :twisted: Used to make it from the apples in my garden in Scotland too, ooarr ooarr!

See, I told you Duncan could produce facty chunks... Now I need to check that dagger reference when I get home but I remember Val Maxfield telling me herself (possibly at the 1989 Limes Congress) and I think John Dore mentioned it to me when he was looking at the pottery from the site (yes folks, it is a non sequitur!).

Mike Bishop
....don't we a have a "what do you drink" yet ?
In case of "not" :
---well, anyway :mrgreen:
Mike Bishop, you should definitely visit Frankfurt/Main/Germany.
This town (and its vicinity)is the capital of Ebbelwei/Äbbelwoi (> apple wine).
The local tram even sports a special line here ( also in English):
http://www.ebbelwei-express.com/
Cool

Greez

Simplex
So, where are they going to build the Tesco's now?
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