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Hello,

I want to name some late Roman field army units in proper Latin, however, my Latin is awful.
Can anybody help me? Here are the units:

* Comitatenses of Gaul
* Comitatenses of Egypt
* Comitatenses of Iberia
* Comitatenses of Africa
* Comitatenses of Italia
* Comitatenses of Illyricum
* Comitatenses of Asia
* Comitatenses of the East
* Comitatenses of Parthia
* Comitatenses of Mesopotamia
* Comitatenses of Armenia
* Comitatenses of Pontus
* Comitatenses of Thracia
* Comitatenses of Britannia
* Comitatenses of Macedonia

Furthermore, can anybody help me in naming Sassanian units in proper old Parsi?

Help will be very appreciated.
Hi Gäiten,

Let me get this straight: you want a Latin translation of the term 'Comitatenses of Gaul'?
But why? This was not a proper name a unit. This is a collection of units in a geographical area, namely Gaul, right?

Maybe a literal translation of 'Comitatenses of Gaul' would be: comitatenses Galliarum (the comitatenses of Gaul), comitatenses in partes Gallia (the diocese), or maybe comitatenses per Gallias (lit. 'the Gauls', the Gallic provinces)?
Quote:I want to name some late Roman field army units in proper Latin, ...
If you check the Notitia Dignitatum, you will find the individual units listed there: http://www.thelatinlibrary.com/notitia.html

For example, if you wish to recreate the Gallic field army, Not. Dig. Occ. VII lists, "In the Gallic provinces with the distinguished Master of Horse of the Gauls, Mattiaci Iuniores, Leones seniores, Brachiati iuniores, Salii seniores, Gratianenses, Bructeri, Ampsivarii, ..." and so on.
Background is a game mod I have been working on for some time.
For that I would like to give the field army units the name of the diocese where they can be recruited.
Somewhat roughly I used the Notitia Dignitatum for choosing the regions. However due some limits of the game, I will have to make some compromises and can not use all possible dioceses.

So, I believe the last of your suggestions (comitatenses per Gallias) would be what I want.
No doubt you've already searched it out for formations and names of units and such, but Maurice's Strategikon is pretty definitive in Late Roman tactics. It has many names in Greek, which is probably perfectly suited to the Eastern side of the Empire.
Quote:No doubt you've already searched it out for formations and names of units and such, but Maurice's Strategikon is pretty definitive in Late Roman tactics. It has many names in Greek, which is probably perfectly suited to the Eastern side of the Empire.

Correct. However, the Strategikon is more suited for the 6th century army, my is in the 5th. IMHO, very different in their TO&E than the 6th century army.

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Could anybody be so friendly to translate the units above in proper Latin?
Quote:Could anybody be so friendly to translate the units above in proper Latin?
If you want to use the descriptions, although no Roman ever used these terms, it's a simple matter to add the geographical term (in genitive case) after the word comitatenses (which is already Latin).

Thus, comitatenses Galliae ("comitatenses of Gaul"), comitatenses Aegypti ("comitatenses of Egypt"), comitatenses Hispaniae ("comitatenses of Spain"), comitatenses Africae ("comitatenses of Africa"), comitatenses Italiae ("comitatenses of Italy"), comitatenses Illyrici ("comitatenses of Illyricum"), comitatenses Asiae ("comitatenses of Asia"), comitatenses Orientis ("comitatenses of the East"), comitatenses Parthiae ("comitatenses of Parthia" !!), comitatenses Mesopotamiae ("comitatenses of Mesopotamia"), comitatenses Armeniae ("comitatenses of Armenia"), comitatenses Ponti ("comitatenses of Pontus"), comitatenses Aegypti ("comitatenses of Egypt"), comitatenses Thraciae ("comitatenses of Thrace"), comitatenses Britanniae ("comitatenses of Britain"), comitatenses Macedoniae ("comitatenses of Macedonia").

Note that some of these territories are not actually appropriate -- e.g., the Notitia talks about "the Gauls", rather than just Gaul, and Belgica is treated separately. In reality, the field armies may have been known by the commander to whom they were attached, rather than the territory in which they operated. Robert, do you have an opinion on this?
Quote:
M. Demetrius:2dssjk03 Wrote:No doubt you've already searched it out for formations and names of units and such, but Maurice's Strategikon is pretty definitive in Late Roman tactics. It has many names in Greek, which is probably perfectly suited to the Eastern side of the Empire.
Correct. However, the Strategikon is more suited for the 6th century army, my is in the 5th. IMHO, very different in their TO&E than the 6th century army
To the contrary, much of what Maurikios describes is very similar to what Arrian described in the 2nd century. It is the opinion of many experts that a great deal of Roman tactics did not change much over the centuries, but that Roman tactics were very versatile. The Strategikon describes formations also in use by Marc Anthony.
Of course there is more attention to cavalry in the Strategikon, but even that will not differ very much from the increasing role of cavalry that took place from the late 3rd and especially early 4th c. onwards.

I think you'll find that the Strategikon is very usable for the 4th c., and even more so for the 5th c.
Quote:Note that some of these territories are not actually appropriate -- e.g., the Notitia talks about "the Gauls", rather than just Gaul, and Belgica is treated separately. In reality, the field armies may have been known by the commander to whom they were attached, rather than the territory in which they operated. Robert, do you have an opinion on this?
No, I think the field armies were named after regions and 'fronts'. Thus you can have 'the field army of the Britains', or 'the field army of the Orient'. Or Thrace, or Illyricum. Of course this was subect to constant change, with the regions becoming smaller and smaller.
Border commands such as the saxon Shore or the Rhine and the Danube could be even smaller (such as the Ducate of Mainz).

The Notitia describes units inside a certain region as "Intra Gallias", so if you would want to describe forces raised inside a diocese, you could use that:
Intra Gallias, comitatenses cum viro magistro equiteum Galliarum: Inside the Gauls, comitatenses under the illuster command of the magister equitum of Gaul.

But Gaïten, Duncan is right - these are descriptions rather unknown to the Romans. Recruits were the responcibility of the civilians governors, so I guess you would have to use the civilian districts as a guide.
Quote:No, I think the field armies were named after regions and 'fronts'. Thus you can have 'the field army of the Britains', or 'the field army of the Orient'. Or Thrace, or Illyricum. ... The Notitia describes units inside a certain region as "Intra Gallias", so if you would want to describe forces raised inside a diocese, you could use that: Intra Gallias, comitatenses cum viro magistro equiteum Galliarum: Inside the Gauls, comitatenses under the illuster command of the magister equitum of Gaul.
Hmmm, I just wondered if, say, the field army in the east would have been the comitatenses magistri militum per Orientem. The Notitia seems to be about assigning units to officials. Your example from the Gauls maybe suggests that the comitatenses were considered to be cum magistro equitum Galliarum (the person) rather than just Galliarum (the place). Maybe too subtle a distinction? Smile
Thank you for help Big Grin

Just curious, what would Comitatenses per Orientis (?) mean?
Often, the preposition per means "through", suggesting progression, such as Porro per nebulam (Onward through [the] fog). There are other contextual meanings though.
Quote:Just curious, what would Comitatenses per Orientis (?) mean?
That would be per Orientem. Smile Magister militum per Orientem ("... throughout the East") is just the particular title given to the man who commanded the legions and equites of the eastern front. He does not appear to have been called the magister militum Orientis ("... of the east"), although the governor of the same territories was the comes Orientis, and the magister's western counterparts took this genitival form (e.g. the dux Britanniarum, not per Britannias).
Ok, Big Grin

Thank you boys, you have helped me very much.