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+--- Thread: Antilabe/Foregrip (/showthread.php?tid=20230)
Antilabe/Foregrip - Dithrambus - 02-03-2012
Forgive me if this has been discussed in the past, but I am curious to know what the general consensus is concerning the fore-grip of an aspis. I purchased this one by DSC: http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=DS02D&name=Greek+Painted+Hoplite+Shield+-+Lion
Image of the back of the shield:
http://www.kultofathena.com/images%5CDS02D_1_l.jpg
The first thing I noticed was how the "carry rope" (excuse my terminology) also serves as the grip, this is extremely uncomfortable and after viewing several period images I have noticed that some depict a fore-grip that appears to be completely separate from the "carry rope", while in some they appear to be the same and in others there appears to be no rope at all, just the fore-grip/antilabe. Thoughts, opinions?
Thanks
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - richard robinson - 02-03-2012
There is evidence for a seperate handle on some depictions if you wish to attach a more comfortable leather one.
I just use rope and pick up the rope in the "sector" above the handgrip in my thumb and find that I can "stear" the shield quite comfortably that way. Others pick up the rope from below and above and find that effective also.
Regards
Richard
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - Dithrambus - 02-03-2012
Quote:There is evidence for a seperate handle on some depictions if you wish to attach a more comfortable leather one.
I just use rope and pick up the rope in the "sector" above the handgrip in my thumb and find that I can "stear" the shield quite comfortably that way. Others pick up the rope from below and above and find that effective also.
Regards
Richard
Thanks Richard, I tried that actually and still found the grip very uncomfortable and at 20 lbs the shield would be much easier to hold, carry, maneuver etc with a more robust grip. I am now more than ever convinced that the antilabe/fore-grip was a separate device independent of the rope, just my opinion at this point and I would certainly appreciate the opinion of others.
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - Giannis K. Hoplite - 02-03-2012
There is no chance that the antilave and the rest of the telamon was one piece. There are hundreds of depictions that clearly show a separate construction than the rope. To complete this opinion, there is a find from Derveni, Macedonia, of a shield with much of the wood preserved. Of the four attachments for the antilave, two are still in their place on the timber, and one of them has a part of the leather antilabe on it! I have seen a photo of it, but you cannot make out the actual shape of the leather. It is flat, folded and twisted. It could have been separated in three parts and then braided, but i couldn't find any clues for that, just that we often see braided antilaves in vases. I think that the leather was 3mm thick.
The shield had rings for the rope, but the antilave was clearly wraped and perhaps stitched around the bronze fitting.
Khaire
Giannis
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - PMBardunias - 02-03-2012
Quote:It could have been separated in three parts and then braided, but i couldn't find any clues for that
That confirms something I have always suspected because those "tassles" we see hanging from the rings inside the aspis are just the unbraided ends of this braided cord.
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - Giannis K. Hoplite - 02-03-2012
But Paul, i was saying that this was only the antilave, not the telamon. Then again, the tassels in early 6th century shields are some times there on their own, without a rope... But on the other hand, in the same early vases, there is a tassel only on the lower end of the antilave...
Tassels also exist on the baldrics of swords, in the lower side of the scabbard. Now about those, i am almost sure that the baldrics were actually tablet woven cylindrical cords, and when they were attached to the rings of the scabbard they left a long fringe, which created the tassels. Could the same have happened with the telamon?
My final bet is still that they were purely decorative...they look cool ;-)
Khaire
Giannis
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - PMBardunias - 02-03-2012
I think this may have been a general feature- it looks cool to leave the frayed ends of braided cords hanging out.
By the way, this reminds me of something. Do you know of any evidence that Spartans hung little bells from inside their aspides? I have read this, but do not know what it is based on.
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - Ghostmojo - 02-04-2012
Quote:I think this may have been a general feature- it looks cool to leave the frayed ends of braided cords hanging out.
By the way, this reminds me of something. Do you know of any evidence that Spartans hung little bells from inside their aspides? I have read this, but do not know what it is based on.
That is interesting Paul. What do you think they might have been for? When marching into battle to the flutes perhaps they shook their shields in time (the rhythm section :wink
:?:
Re: Antilabe/Foregrip - Giannis K. Hoplite - 02-04-2012
I have never come accross this detail. Where does it come from?